DBLXX Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 When I hit the starter button it takes 10 or 12 pushes to get it to start. Once it starts the idol is extremely low... to the point it sometimes stalls. There is a 3 position choke, up (high), middle (medium) and low position which is no choke. In the high position it won't start at all. The middle position doesn't really work either. I started adjusting the idol screw (clockwise) to increase the idol and now it's even harder to start. I'm going to adjust it back down so it requires a lower idol to stay started. Any suggestions? Seems as if this is a known issue and reading that a lot of people change out the carburetor... which, I will not be doing. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 Warranty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBLXX Posted June 20, 2023 Author Share Posted June 20, 2023 I knew someone would tell me to bring it back... I just hate dealers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Knievel Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 (edited) Manual chokes are tricky sometimes. If the plugs are accessible, pull them and see if they fouled. Also, assuming it's electric start, parallel attach a second 12v battery to supply more than enough CCAs. See if that fixes it. Small bike often means small battery, and maybe your battery isn't putting out enough to both crank and properly spark. If it floods the motor, then you really struggle to get it to start. Edited June 20, 2023 by Zero Knievel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBLXX Posted June 20, 2023 Author Share Posted June 20, 2023 Fouled? With 2 miles on it? It's a single so there is 1 plug and I'll check it. The battery is huge for this small bike, so it's not the push. THX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomek Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 You need to install jet kit for the bike. And properly adjust carburetor. If you bump idle speed it will actually make bike harder to start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomek Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 (edited) And you need to beat the shit out of it to brake in the engine. Compression could still be low and too much internal friction. That's why it idles low. Edited June 20, 2023 by tomek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBLXX Posted June 20, 2023 Author Share Posted June 20, 2023 Very helpful, thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 18 minutes ago, DBLXX said: Fouled? With 2 miles on it? It's a single so there is 1 plug and I'll check it. The battery is huge for this small bike, so it's not the push. THX LOL. Yeah, exactly. So raising the idle speed opens the throttle, which during start is making it even more lean. Then you choke it to forcibly add more fuel through suction, and everything goes fucking nuts and unpredictable. Get the idle speed screw back to normal. I assume there's no visible/reachable idle mixture screw? Try this method: Start with the choke open, hit the button, and turn up the choke slowly until it starts. This will let you find the right mix for that moment. Also, fuck carbs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBLXX Posted June 20, 2023 Author Share Posted June 20, 2023 4 minutes ago, SwampNut said: LOL. Yeah, exactly. So raising the idle speed opens the throttle, which during start is making it even more lean. Then you choke it to forcibly add more fuel through suction, and everything goes fucking nuts and unpredictable. Get the idle speed screw back to normal. I assume there's no visible/reachable idle mixture screw? Try this method: Start with the choke open, hit the button, and turn up the choke slowly until it starts. This will let you find the right mix for that moment. Also, fuck carbs. I believe this is the idle screw (I'm sure of it)... it's the one I turned to raise the idle. So you are saying to open the choke all the way... and back the idle down (counter clockwise on that screw) little by little until it starts or leave the choke off and get it back down to where it was? Thx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 Yeah, that's the idle speed screw. The idle air screw may be in that hole, but ignore that for now. By having the idle speed normal, and attempting to start it with zero choke (full open), you won't flood it. Then you increase choke until it fires. You either learn what it likes, or that something is fucked and you have to deal with the dealer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBLXX Posted June 20, 2023 Author Share Posted June 20, 2023 It's known with this particular bike... I got that from a simple google. The choke is not your typical choke where you pull a level it's a clicker with 3 set positions - Off, Middle, and High. High... it won't start at all and middle it starts but really no different then with it's off. I'll back off the idle speed back to where it was when it would start and stay started for a few seconds then die. Hitting it a dozen times like that... it will stay started a "touch longer" each time until it stays on. Fast forward to 27 seconds... his started right up but you can get a feel for how LOW it idles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 Fucking Honda. When the Chinese clone runs better for half the price....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBLXX Posted June 20, 2023 Author Share Posted June 20, 2023 A few of the Chinese models were actually more than the Honda but they also had a few that were less but visually looked like toys and junk. I paid $3100. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Knievel Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 1 hour ago, DBLXX said: Fouled? With 2 miles on it? It's a single so there is 1 plug and I'll check it. My brush mower fouled the plug after a bad start. I didn't think that was possible, but change the spark plug and all is good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackhawkxx Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 I would call the dealer and speak to the service manager. Ask if this is a common thing and is there something you could do or possibly talk to a mechanic. They might just say to bring it in or maybe give you helpful info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBLXX Posted June 20, 2023 Author Share Posted June 20, 2023 2 hours ago, blackhawkxx said: I would call the dealer and speak to the service manager. Ask if this is a common thing and is there something you could do or possibly talk to a mechanic. They might just say to bring it in or maybe give you helpful info. I was trying to avoid that but think I may take your advice before I start fiddling with a brand new bike. Appreciate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superhawk996 Posted June 20, 2023 Share Posted June 20, 2023 Unless you noted where the idle screw was before messing with it you'll have to get it running and warmed up to reset it. Ideally with a tach, but you might get it close enough by ear. The manual should show the cold start procedure. Typically it would be- full choke to start, drop to half choke to warm up, choke off when warmed. Only starting with no choke tells me something is very wrong with it, or you're using the choke backwards and actually full choking it when you think it's fully off. Most modern carbed bikes have a very lean idle mixture for emissions. The idle air/fuel mixture screw is probably covered so you can't mess with it, another emissions thing. It 'shouldn't' need adjusting, but it might benefit from a small tweak, especially if you're at low altitude where it would run the leanest. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMG Posted June 21, 2023 Share Posted June 21, 2023 13 hours ago, superhawk996 said: especially if you're at low altitude where it would run the leanest. Now now, he's not that short. 'Carburetter' - French word translated to 'leave it alone' By all means, call and ask to speak with the lead mechanic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOXXIC Posted June 21, 2023 Share Posted June 21, 2023 Actually surprised it is not EFI? Pretty sure the GROM and other newer, smaller motors are EFI. Shocking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted June 21, 2023 Share Posted June 21, 2023 28 minutes ago, TOXXIC said: Actually surprised it is not EFI? Pretty sure the GROM and other newer, smaller motors are EFI. Shocking. It's a 1990s bargain bike, just the basics. When I compared it to a Chinese bike, I was not joking. Nor talking shit. It has a place as a good basic bike. But they definitely cut expenses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBLXX Posted June 21, 2023 Author Share Posted June 21, 2023 22 hours ago, superhawk996 said: Unless you noted where the idle screw was before messing with it you'll have to get it running and warmed up to reset it. Ideally with a tach, but you might get it close enough by ear. The manual should show the cold start procedure. Typically it would be- full choke to start, drop to half choke to warm up, choke off when warmed. Only starting with no choke tells me something is very wrong with it, or you're using the choke backwards and actually full choking it when you think it's fully off. Most modern carbed bikes have a very lean idle mixture for emissions. The idle air/fuel mixture screw is probably covered so you can't mess with it, another emissions thing. It 'shouldn't' need adjusting, but it might benefit from a small tweak, especially if you're at low altitude where it would run the leanest. Agreed - for $3K you’ve got to level set your expectations. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T REXX14 Posted June 22, 2023 Share Posted June 22, 2023 Hopefully you remember the old screw setting, just put it back for now. It should be lean not rich from the factory, so it is weird it will not start with the choke on. You will most likely need to put 500 or so miles on it to loosen up the motor and it will idle a bit higher. If it is still a problem you may have to go up a size on the pilot jet. Looks like a fun camping bike! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveK Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 Called the dealer like Black recommended. They said back it to the original spot and actually make it a bit lower which will get it to actually rely on the choke and the choke will work. So - backed it to the original spot THEN a 1/4 turn lower. Flipped the choke to half way - FIRED RIGHT UP !!! Thanks for all the suggestions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Knievel Posted June 24, 2023 Share Posted June 24, 2023 So, it comes down to the age old question, “Were you fucking with it?” 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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