XXitanium Posted September 7, 2023 Author Share Posted September 7, 2023 The breaker popped a second time. I left it off. If I go get the RMTEX-06, it's 240V. I'm already wired correctly. If I throttle it down with a mixing valves will it use a little less electricity, but not trip the breaker? ...it shouldn't... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackhawkxx Posted September 7, 2023 Share Posted September 7, 2023 16 hours ago, SwampNut said: You can have my excessively hot water when you pry it out of my burnt fingers. You live on the sun, why do you want excessively hot water? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CALCXX Posted September 7, 2023 Share Posted September 7, 2023 (edited) Anytime it's heating, it will draw the same amount of current. 10ga wire minimum. Your guide shows a 1P 30a breaker for the 220v 06 model. You don't have 220v on a 1-Pole breaker. The guide is a little misleading. Europe. You can;t get 220v on one phase using the neutral at your house. You would have to wire 1 Line directly hot instead of the neutral. Don't do it. Baseboard heaters were allowed to do that in the sixties. NEC put a stop to that bullshit. Neither the 04 and 06 have a thermostat. You need to rethink this application. If you have 10ga wire in the wall, connect one Line to a 30A 1P breaker, one line to neutral for 120v. Since you don't have temp control, you can do the mixing valve thing or buy one with a thermostat. Bill, don't run it anymore until this is corrected. The 220V 1ph is Europe. That can be confusing. In the U.S., and in fact everywhere in North America, the standard voltage is 110 V (with a frequency of 60 Hz) rather than the 220 volts used in Europe. The 06 model will not help your situation. Edited September 7, 2023 by CALCXX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXitanium Posted September 7, 2023 Author Share Posted September 7, 2023 Yeah, somebody tried to save a couple bucks and combine the 4KW with the 6KW installation manuals. If I'm looking at this right the 6KW can be hooked to American 240 single phase, (2) -120 volt hot legs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXitanium Posted September 7, 2023 Author Share Posted September 7, 2023 I think that manual is a lawsuit waiting to happen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXitanium Posted September 9, 2023 Author Share Posted September 9, 2023 I found a 6kW for $40 less than the 4kW on line. I still need to get a mixing valve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMG Posted September 19, 2023 Share Posted September 19, 2023 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CALCXX Posted September 21, 2023 Share Posted September 21, 2023 (edited) Bill, the guide is misleading. Remember, your name plate says 120v. You don't have 220v on 1 phase. Nameplate is everything. Ask your home insurance agent what he thinks about supplying 220v to this 120v rated appliance. Edited September 21, 2023 by CALCXX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXitanium Posted September 21, 2023 Author Share Posted September 21, 2023 No, I bought a 240V unit. The 120V is getting pulled when I get time. The breaker is off till then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXitanium Posted September 21, 2023 Author Share Posted September 21, 2023 The 6kW is 240V. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RXX Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 Bill, we use under-sink water heaters in all of our clean rooms, and I have had to fiddle with a few. I am not sure what V they are on and I am off for the week, so won’t know till next week. That being said, I do know that in our units the temp rise or fall is controlled by water flow, not thermostat (which is non-existent AFAIK) Increasing the flow lowers the temp, duh. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 100% of water heaters have thermostat. But like the conversation about EV parts and "what is a tachomoter," how it's employed and the results you see may vary. There is absolute no heating appliance sold in the US that doesn't have an over-temp thermostat. Now, what other benefits are written into the software controlling it (and yes, pretty much everything has some form of crude software), will vary. And as you noted, even just an "on" command could still mean you run past the heating ability. I would expect better quality units would use good software PIDs and a high-watt heater to hold a fixed temp no matter what. Would be easy really. PID software is commonly used for everything that needs to have predictive control, from quadcopters to advanced cruise control to...heating... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 Also the above post is totally useless for Bill's needs and I just love exploring the hidden world that runs our lives. Without a PID, my toaster oven could not make perfect toast, as it does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXitanium Posted October 3, 2023 Author Share Posted October 3, 2023 The 110V is sitting on the kitchen table waiting to get returned. In a different economic position, I might pull it apart and look at the guts, but I need the cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXitanium Posted October 3, 2023 Author Share Posted October 3, 2023 4 hours ago, RXX said: Bill, we use under-sink water heaters in all of our clean rooms, and I have had to fiddle with a few. I am not sure what V they are on and I am off for the week, so won’t know till next week. That being said, I do know that in our units the temp rise or fall is controlled by water flow, not thermostat (which is non-existent AFAIK) Increasing the flow lowers the temp, duh. Hope this helps. Your thermostat may be only a set-point. When it gets hot enough, it shuts off. That's what mine does. If the gas water heater eventually sends water hotter than the POU heater thermostat (sensor) requires, it just takes a break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RXX Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 2 hours ago, SwampNut said: 100% of water heaters have thermostat. But like the conversation about EV parts and "what is a tachomoter," how it's employed and the results you see may vary. There is absolute no heating appliance sold in the US that doesn't have an over-temp thermostat. Now, what other benefits are written into the software controlling it (and yes, pretty much everything has some form of crude software), will vary. And as you noted, even just an "on" command could still mean you run past the heating ability. I would expect better quality units would use good software PIDs and a high-watt heater to hold a fixed temp no matter what. Would be easy really. PID software is commonly used for everything that needs to have predictive control, from quadcopters to advanced cruise control to...heating... “There are no facts…… just interpretations” -Nietzsche FlowCo™ is a reliable non-thermostatic water heater delivering endless hot water on demand. FlowCo™ is ideal for single, sensor faucet or single, metering faucet for handwashing and other fixed-flow applications. The heater features self-diagnostics with intelligent controls, SafeStart™ technology, and 3/8" compression fittings. InfoCue™, a visible LED indicator, indicates system status and operation feedback. The unit mounts in any orientation and is compact in size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 It's like that tachometer. The Zero has one, the Tesla doesn't. No wait, of course, it has one, like every heating device has a thermostat. But we just don't show it, or use it in a way that you can tell. But we have to know, so we don't blow up. But you get no benefit other than not blowing up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XXitanium Posted October 3, 2023 Author Share Posted October 3, 2023 It isn't adjustable. ...not like your home tank water heater. https://www.amazon.com/Eemax-SPEX35-FlowCo-Kilowatt-Electric/dp/B07MMDH6PJ#immersive-view_1696371592525 The sensor - I'm making an educated guess, is the black round jobber with two leads. It's probably controlled via a circuit. An electronics expert could probably figure out how to adjust it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 Not adjustable, ever, unless you can change the laws of physics affecting a bimetal strip. It's not a sensor, it's a simple click switch. They are all over your kitchen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RXX Posted October 4, 2023 Share Posted October 4, 2023 17 hours ago, XXitanium said: Your thermostat may be only a set-point. When it gets hot enough, it shuts off. That's what mine does. If the gas water heater eventually sends water hotter than the POU heater thermostat (sensor) requires, it just takes a break. Actually (again AFAIK, I haven’t fiddled with the things for a few years) the unit works by having water pressure energizing a solenoid which in turn energized the heating element. If you want hotter water, you reduce the flow to the unit and vice versa. I have to occasionally reduce the flow to effect a 20 degree rise in temperature. The heating element is probably getting gunked up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superhawk996 Posted October 4, 2023 Share Posted October 4, 2023 21 hours ago, SwampNut said: 100% of water heaters have thermostat. But like the conversation about EV parts and "what is a tachomoter," how it's employed and the results you see may vary. There is absolute no heating appliance sold in the US that doesn't have an over-temp thermostat. Now, what other benefits are written into the software controlling it (and yes, pretty much everything has some form of crude software), will vary. And as you noted, even just an "on" command could still mean you run past the heating ability. I would expect better quality units would use good software PIDs and a high-watt heater to hold a fixed temp no matter what. Would be easy really. PID software is commonly used for everything that needs to have predictive control, from quadcopters to advanced cruise control to...heating... My tankless doesn't have a thermostat. The water temp is based on the size of the fire which is based on water flow, but there's no sensor for it to know what the water temp is. There's no electronics, it's purely mechanical. Two knobs let you set the minimum flow cut-in and max fire size, then it regulates from there. It does have an over-temp switch in the flue and another in the water outlet. Both are switches, no regulation, they shut the gas off if either gets too hot. They shut the valve off completely so you have to re-light the pilot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampNut Posted October 4, 2023 Share Posted October 4, 2023 Just now, superhawk996 said: It does have an over-temp switch So, a thermostat... It's pedantic, yeah, like when Philip asked about what parts are in a car, was my point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superhawk996 Posted October 4, 2023 Share Posted October 4, 2023 On 9/7/2023 at 11:02 AM, XXitanium said: I think that manual is a lawsuit waiting to happen. It's probably Chinese, they don't care. The wiring diagram on my milling machine's motor is worse than useless. I had two other people look at it to make sure I wasn't seeing it wrong. When wired as shown it instantly blows the 30A garage fuse. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMG Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 On 10/4/2023 at 8:31 AM, superhawk996 said: The water temp is based on the size of the fire which is based on water flow Add in the incoming temp. Montana that can be in the low 40s - Phoenix summer you can't get colder than 65 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superhawk996 Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 11 minutes ago, OMG said: Add in the incoming temp. Montana that can be in the low 40s - Phoenix summer you can't get colder than 65 Yea. In the summer I can't get the water cool enough to shower comfortably without the heater shutting off due to insufficient flow to keep it 'triggered' on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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