Jump to content
CBR1100XX.org Forum

Wierd Problem with Nissan Frontier (Help!)


jon haney
 Share

Recommended Posts

Don't know, I'm just telling you the master tech sent me a video of a Titan that had the exact same issue you are describing and all they did was switch out the ends with the correct ones.  He said the lead ends cause a voltage drop on start-up, which is the same reason they had to replace that relay (the relay was "fluttering" causing hard start issues leading to early failure.)  The lead ends have a much higher resistance than the Nissan end I would imagine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, jon haney said:

I'm curious to know how lead terminals can be a problem, if you keep them cleaned?

They don't.  Unless you're an environmentalist.

 

Copper is more conductive, but lead provides more contact area.  Each has its ups and downs comparatively, but both will work fine if they're in good condition.  I've replaced many OEM copper terminals with lead and have never had a problem.  I've also replaced a few with cheap steel terminals, which is probably the worst option, and never had a problem.  If you clamp a battery tester to anything but lead you're more likely to get a falsely low reading.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, OMG said:

Does that truck have the move to a warm climate option?

And just like that, someone come along comes the easy fix.

 

 

Jon, let me know when to expect it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, superhawk996 said:

And just like that, someone come along comes the easy fix.

 

 

Jon, let me know when to expect it.

LOL.  My son talks like he wants to keep it forever.  Probably end up as wealthy as that truck guy over in the 10mm socket thread of the Atlas tear-down.  Can't remember who posted that pic.

Edited by jon haney
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, XXitanium said:

...any updates?

 

Tomorrow morning is the first (sort of) cold weather test.  The forecast low is 41 degrees.  All I did was clean the terminals, and make sure all the bolts were tight on the battery cables.  Wife works from home on Wed. and Thurs. so she can take him to school, if it don't start.  If it fails, I'll get a new battery, and try again Thursday morning.

I did order new Nissan battery clamps, and ground cable, so that will get done, anyway.  Hopefully, this weekend, if they shipped them yesterday.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Truck started just fine this morning, 36 degrees, so I'm thinking Furbird may be on to something with terminal material, and need for max voltage thing.  New negative cable and positive clamp on the way (genuine Nissan).  Gonna replace the battery too, just to be sure.

Edited by jon haney
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, jon haney said:

Truck started just fine this morning, 36 degrees, so I'm thinking Furbird may be on to something with terminal material, and need for max voltage thing.  New negative cable and positive clamp on the way (genuine Nissan).  Gonna replace the battery too, just to be sure.

For the sake of the test, you shouldn't replace the battery unless it won't start again ( at least for a while).  I also have a hard time believing that lead terminals in like new condition wouldn't work as well. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, blackhawkxx said:

For the sake of the test, you shouldn't replace the battery unless it won't start again ( at least for a while).  I also have a hard time believing that lead terminals in like new condition wouldn't work as well. 

Yup, if they're installed correctly.  I've used dozens (maybe hundreds) of them with no issues, and have had to fix some installed by others that were causing issues. In most cases there's a cable to the starter and another that feeds everything else.  Even tho the replacement terminal clamps them both together there's no guarantee that one of them isn't making a shitty connection.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, blackhawkxx said:

For the sake of the test, you shouldn't replace the battery unless it won't start again ( at least for a while).  I also have a hard time believing that lead terminals in like new condition wouldn't work as well. 

They aren't in "like new" condition, but not corroded either.  Just a dark outer layer of oxidation.  No idea how old they are.  I probably put them on years ago for my father-in-law, and just don't remember.  Wire brushing the inside of the clamps, and the battery posts seem to do the trick, for now.  The negative cable was cut and clamped into the lead terminal, so there is another place where a "marginal contact" can happen.  Hence, new OEM clamps and battery.  If I have any more trouble with it, I'll replace to the ECM relay.

My son has no desire to learn much in the way of auto mechanics or electrical, so want to make sure he doesn't get stranded.

Edited by jon haney
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

UPDATE:

New terminals and ground cable didn't fix the problem, but helped.  Brand new battery with 890 CCA, instead of the cheap 540 CCA battery that was in it, did the trick.  Fired right up in 20 degree weather.  Interesting how something can work (crank the engine), but not work (no start).  Fancy electronics are great, until they're not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How quickly we forget the adventure of having points/condensor fail randomly in the middle of the night or water getting into the cracked piece of shit distributor cap...  Then you get your old five-cell Maglight and try to balance it on the fender while trying to avoid it shorting out the battery.  You're five minutes into finding your sandpaper and some cleaner when the light goes dim....dimmer...oh no.  Now you use your remaining battery life to find more batteries in the trunk, where you find them rusty from the leak in those shitty 70s seals.  You use the sandpaper to clean them just in time to get your light back.  Clean the points, and nothing.  Oh, is the condenser shorted, is the cap bridging?  Did the coil just randomly fry?

 

Good times.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 minutes ago, SwampNut said:

How quickly we forget the adventure of having points/condensor fail randomly in the middle of the night or water getting into the cracked piece of shit distributor cap...  Then you get your old five-cell Maglight and try to balance it on the fender while trying to avoid it shorting out the battery.  You're five minutes into finding your sandpaper and some cleaner when the light goes dim....dimmer...oh no.  Now you use your remaining battery life to find more batteries in the trunk, where you find them rusty from the leak in those shitty 70s seals.  You use the sandpaper to clean them just in time to get your light back.  Clean the points, and nothing.  Oh, is the condenser shorted, is the cap bridging?  Did the coil just randomly fry?

 

Good times.

 

As a Cuban, you should be able to see the advantage of simplicity and the ability in keeping a car running.  😉

Yes, new stuff works better but like said, when it doesn't, diagnosing can be pretty tough without expensive equipment and much knowledge.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't recall a single instance of points suddenly failing, they slowly degrade so as long as one is somewhat aware they can take care of it at a convenient moment.  If they shit out they can typically be brought back on the side of the road.  Electronics usually go from perfect to dead whenever they decide to and the chances of a roadside DIY fix is around 0%.  But electronics are awesome when they're working.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, jon haney said:

UPDATE:

New terminals and ground cable didn't fix the problem, but helped.  Brand new battery with 890 CCA, instead of the cheap 540 CCA battery that was in it, did the trick.  Fired right up in 20 degree weather.  Interesting how something can work (crank the engine), but not work (no start).  Fancy electronics are great, until they're not.

From what I read the better battery and good connections are somewhat of a band-aid, but they can often be a long term band-aid.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, blackhawkxx said:

Yes, new stuff works better but like said, when it doesn't, diagnosing can be pretty tough without expensive equipment and much knowledge.

Most diagnostics are pretty simple and just require a cheap scanner.  But there are times where it becomes nearly impossible without the equipment and knowledge.  Canbus is a prime enemy, that shit can go fuck itself.

 

Canbus fuckery example on a customer's diesel Jetta: ABS light came on so she called me right away.  No biggie, probably just a wheel speed sensor, swing by after work and I'll scan it.  Minutes later the fuel gauge went to 0, then the tack to 0, speedo to 0, trans stopped shifting, then slow limp mode.  Stop and restart the car and everything's fine, then the cascade starts again whenever it feels like it.  After some checks I tapped out and told them to take it to the dealer.  They said the ABS module and transmission needed to be replaced, around $11K.  I told them I had a hunch, no guarantees, $1300.  I had the ABS module repaired and that cured everything.  A bad solder joint in the ABS module caused the whole system to shit out.  Fuck that shit.  What's weirdest to me is that everything didn't die at once and sometimes only a few things would shit out for a pretty long time.  I'd expect an instant system failure, but it was always a cascading effect.  Maybe the system was compensating for the high resistance for as long as it could, dunno.

Edited by superhawk996
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, blackhawkxx said:

Couldn't grab one from the junk yard?

Sure, but it's a bit of a bitch to get to.  Also, it's "VIN matched" to the car so it would have to be programmed by VW or someone with the right computer so that the car would accept it.  And there's no guarantee that it didn't already have the same problem since it was fairly common.  Fixing the existing one was as close to guaranteed as possible without having it done at VW for $3000.

 

I've repaired a few other modules that had solder problems or parts failures, but this one is multi-layered and requires a lot of de-soldering/re-soldering to get to the problematic solder joint.  If it was mine I might give it a go, but for a customer I want someone more experienced to handle it.  Actually, I'd probably just cut the case to get straight to the problem joint and then re-seal it, I've done that a few times with other components.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/14/2022 at 1:56 PM, SwampNut said:

How quickly we forget the adventure of having points/condensor fail randomly in the middle of the night or water getting into the cracked piece of shit distributor cap...  Then you get your old five-cell Maglight and try to balance it on the fender while trying to avoid it shorting out the battery.  You're five minutes into finding your sandpaper and some cleaner when the light goes dim....dimmer...oh no.  Now you use your remaining battery life to find more batteries in the trunk, where you find them rusty from the leak in those shitty 70s seals.  You use the sandpaper to clean them just in time to get your light back.  Clean the points, and nothing.  Oh, is the condenser shorted, is the cap bridging?  Did the coil just randomly fry?

 

Good times.

 

How old do you think I am?

👴

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 hours ago, superhawk996 said:

Most diagnostics are pretty simple and just require a cheap scanner.  But there are times where it becomes nearly impossible without the equipment and knowledge.  Canbus is a prime enemy, that shit can go fuck itself.

 

Canbus fuckery example on a customer's diesel Jetta: ABS light came on so she called me right away.  No biggie, probably just a wheel speed sensor, swing by after work and I'll scan it.  Minutes later the fuel gauge went to 0, then the tack to 0, speedo to 0, trans stopped shifting, then slow limp mode.  Stop and restart the car and everything's fine, then the cascade starts again whenever it feels like it.  After some checks I tapped out and told them to take it to the dealer.  They said the ABS module and transmission needed to be replaced, around $11K.  I told them I had a hunch, no guarantees, $1300.  I had the ABS module repaired and that cured everything.  A bad solder joint in the ABS module caused the whole system to shit out.  Fuck that shit.  What's weirdest to me is that everything didn't die at once and sometimes only a few things would shit out for a pretty long time.  I'd expect an instant system failure, but it was always a cascading effect.  Maybe the system was compensating for the high resistance for as long as it could, dunno.

That was so nice of the dealer to suggest replacing the whole transmission, ya know, just in case.

FUCKING THIEVES!

 

Most people have no clue how much they are getting screwed when they know absolutely nothing about their own vehicles.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use