A quick and easy explanation of how diabetes T2 is primarily an animal fat disease, not carbs

[SwampNut]

I'm sure I've posted about this before but this is the most quick and easy explanation I've heard from a doctor.  It used to be assumed to be related to sugar and carbs.  Obviously, sugar triggers the symptoms, but the root cause is animal products.

 

 

 

Full episodes:  https://www.alieward.com/ologies/diabetology

 

New discussions that I haven't heard yet:  https://www.alieward.com/ologies/diabetologyencore

 

 

Oh wow. And does that happen where you, kind of, exhaust your pancreas? It has put out so much insulin over so much time that it just one day is like, “Fuck all y'all, I'm out.”? [low pitch, slowed down] Fuck all y’all, I’m out.

 

I think there's a component of that. It's actually a really exciting time in research very, very recently. Most people think, “Oh you ate too much crap. You ate too much carbs and sugar.” But what we're finding more and more is that it's actually the animal products and the fat that we're eating, specifically the long-chain fatty acids and the saturated fats. And what's happening is there's fat deposition, so fat is kind of accumulating in things like the liver, your skeletal muscle, and the pancreas. And that is spawning a storm of proinflammatory cytokines, so you're getting a lot of inflammation. That inflammation is really detrimental. You're getting free radicals, and oxidation, and all that stuff, and that's really gunking up the works of the insulin receptors.

 

Initially it's an issue of insulin insensitivity. The lock is broken, the key is there. And so very early on in type 2, you actually see a hyper-insulin state because your pancreas is saying, “Oh shit, my insulin I'm secreting isn't doing anything. Let's pump out extra.” It's falling on deaf ears. For that reason, eventually you'll have some of that, like you said, the pancreas pooping out. But then there's also some thought that this is also secondary to the fat deposition and inflammation in the pancreas as well.

 

Aside: If you’re silently analyzing your diets right now you are not alone, my friend.

 

The question of like, “Should I eat paleo? Should I eat keto? Should I eat plant based?” Plant- based diets have evidence that suggest that they help treat and prevent certain disease processes like type 2 diabetes. And I do think that is a very healthy way to go. There's good data for other diets that are out there, but the only one that I know that I've seen with empirical data behind it that seems very good is the plant-based diet.

 

 

Really! That's so fascinating. And so if you are, say, pre-diabetic, what exactly does that mean and what can you do? Can you turn this boat around? If you have type 2 diabetes, can you turn the cruise ship around? What are we talkin’ here? What kind of U-turns?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[XXBirdSlapper]

4 hours ago, SwampNut said:

this is the most quick and easy explanation I've heard from a doctor.

Citations needed.

[blackhawkxx]

So vegetarians should NOT get diabetes?

[SwampNut]

3 hours ago, blackhawkxx said:

So vegetarians should NOT get diabetes?

 

I can't tell if you're trolling.  Risk reduction and correlation don't work that way, but it is less likely.  "Non-smokers shouldn't get lung cancer?"

[blackhawkxx]

5 hours ago, SwampNut said:

 

I can't tell if you're trolling.  Risk reduction and correlation don't work that way, but it is less likely.  "Non-smokers shouldn't get lung cancer?"

I wasn't trolling but your headline-"how diabetes T2 is primarily an animal fat disease, not carbs" made it sound like my question.  Yes I understand weight and diet has a huge effect on diabetes.

[SwampNut]

"Primarily" != "Only"

 

I try to use precise, medical, fact based terms as much as possible.  The exact wording of the headline actually came from another doctor word for word.  And they shouldn't be taken to mean anything more than what they say directly.  I just had some pretty unhealthy meats this weekend, I'm not a saint, just *aware* of what it means.

 

 

 

 

[SwampNut]

Coincidentally, another doctor I follow posted this a couple hours ago, but it's just a reference to something he wrote up years ago.

 

 

 

https://nutritionfacts.org/video/what-causes-diabetes/

 

What Causes Diabetes?

Michael Greger M.D. FACLM · June 26, 2015 · Volume 25

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

3.6/5 - (313 votes) 

 

Saturated fat can be toxic to the insulin-producing beta cells in the pancreas, explaining why animal fat consumption can impair insulin secretion, not just insulin sensitivity.

[jon haney]

29 minutes ago, SwampNut said:

Coincidentally, another doctor I follow posted this a couple hours ago, but it's just a reference to something he wrote up years ago.

 

 

LOL.  That's like saying, "If you don't go outside on a rainy day, you may not get wet."

 

I'm not debating anything that the doctors say, but it just seems too obvious that if you eat a mostly plant-based diet, you're going to take in less fat, less simple carbs, and less calories.  That should mean less fat on your body, which I believe is the key to preventing/reversing/controlling T2 diabetes.  Get your weight under control, by what ever means works for you.  One size does not fit all.  Genetics play a big role, as well.  My dad was fairly heavy, ate all kinds of crap, and even in his 80's had steady blood sugar levels.  My mother didn't get T2 until she was over retirement age, and easily controlled it with oral medication and diet alone, same as my wife. 

[blackhawkxx]

51 minutes ago, jon haney said:

One size does not fit all.  Genetics play a big role, as well.

This.

[SwampNut]

One size does fit all when it comes to risk reduction.  We have very well proven this.  The question or variable is how much risk and how much reduction.  Genetics is becoming less of a factor in many diseases, we're discovering, but interestingly enough, it's becoming more of a factor in T2.  More than T1...the genetic version of diabetes.  100% of Americans will be healthier with more plants and less animals.

 

 

 

[tomek]

 Curious what kind of risks are associated with cigar smoking.  Never mind. 

 

 I'd like to point out it is all about saturated fat, not a wide blanket that applies to all animal foods. So, pick lean meats, Omega 3 rich fish like salmon, trout, macrel, herring, etc. Low fat or no fat diary. 

 It is not all or nothing. 

[SwampNut]

Why Do Milk Drinkers Live Shorter Lives on Average?

https://nutritionfacts.org/video/why-do-milk-drinkers-live-shorter-lives-on-average/?subscriber=true

 

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31776125/

 

 

 

AND have higher incidences of some bone fractures?  Could we have been lied to by billionaires peddling their goods?

 

 

 

[tomek]

Humanity, or more specifically all mammals have been doing all wrong by feeding babies with milk. It is, obviously, deadly, in any quantities. 

 Milk kills. 

[tomek]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8072827/ 

 

 

 

[SwampNut]

On 2/13/2024 at 4:56 PM, jon haney said:

Genetics play a big role, as well.

 

 

 

 

[XXBirdSlapper]

2 hours ago, SwampNut said:

 

 

 

 

May be able to.

 

Then again, maybe not.

[SwampNut]

I don't know who "we" is, but unfortunately I fell for the massive amount of bullshit that seemed to be prevalent until recently, that carbs were the problem.  I have no doubt that those lies and food marketing have made me less healthy.

 

 

 

https://nutritionfacts.org/video/what-causes-insulin-resistance/

 

[blackhawkxx]

So this is talking about high fat not high protein as in lean meat correct?  So your hot wings=bad, lean breast=good.

[XXBirdSlapper]

9 minutes ago, blackhawkxx said:

So this is talking about high fat not high protein as in lean meat correct?  So your hot wings=bad, lean breast=good.

No that's bad too, because the Satanic Chicken Torture industry is destroying the world via global warming.

[SwampNut]

12 hours ago, blackhawkxx said:

So this is talking about high fat not high protein as in lean meat correct?  So your hot wings=bad, lean breast=good.

 

That seems accurate.  There are other reasons to avoid the lean breast, but not this one.

 

[superhawk996]

How much difference, if any, is there between the fat you can see on meats vs. the fats in the meat?  If you trim off the obvious fat around your steak are you helping, or is that fat good/non-damaging?

[SwampNut]

Fuck, great question, and no idea.  But I know where to ask...

 

AI thinks it's a good thing to remove it, and that it's junk calories with no benefit.  One minor disagreement I have on flavor is that if you char the outside fat, that can be really great-tasting.  It's also strongly connected to oxidative stress and increased cancer.  Worth it?  Maybe, LOL.

 

https://www.perplexity.ai/search/How-much-difference-TCp5doZjSHOfySVQCcGOLg#0

 

 

[tomek]

 Generally speaking if something tastes great is probably not that great for you. 

[superhawk996]

1 hour ago, SwampNut said:

One minor disagreement I have on flavor is that if you char the outside fat, that can be really great-tasting.

I hate gooey fat, but charred is usually tasty, whether cow or pig.  Randy talks shit about me removing it, "you should eat that, it's good for you."  It's a bit of a hard sell when nutritional advice is coming from someone twice my size who's breakfast is a fist full of pills.

[SwampNut]

LOL, yeah.  It's well proven that grill char = inflammation, oxidation, and cancer.

 

Grilling can create cancer-causing chemicals

When cooking over high heat, especially an open flame, you are exposed to two main carcinogens: heterocyclic aromatic amines (HCAs) and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs). Studies show HCAs and PAHs cause changes in DNA that may increase the risk of cancer.