EVLXX Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 So with the cold weather setting in for us Higher elevation and Latitude guys, the question crossed my brain... How long should a person let there engine warm up before driving/Riding ? So say the vehicle has been sitting outside overnight and the temp gets down to 10 degrees. Or maybe even colder... I've seen below zero a few morning here lately. Car, Bike, Truck... newer or older engine... whatever, whichever... 30 seconds ? 1 minute ? Until the needle on the temp gage starts to Rise ? .... What do you do... or what have you been told is the best practice ? ... Second part... I wonder how long it going to take before a certain individual from Arizona chimes in with one of his classic comments? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spicholy Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 When it is below twenty, I usually let my Focus warm up for 10 minutes or so. For a couple of reasons. It shifts very tightly when it is cold, manual transmission. I like a warm interior. Defrost windows. I have a warm engine to accelerate hard onto the main road. There is usually very little gap between cars. No slow pokes allowed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomek Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 It shifts very tightly when it is cold, manual transmission. That is why God created synthetic lubricants , it is your friend in low temps. For tranny ( ) I recommend Red Line`s GL4. You are not gonna believe how much better your gearbox will work . Cold and warm. Normally , I don`t bother with engine warm up , I just take it easy on revs and load till I get some readings on coolant gauge. As far as warming up the interior , I now drive Volvo anyway ,the heaters are unreal on those things . It is blowing hot air after mile or two in -20 deg F . No point in wasting fuel by idling. Synthetic 0w/30 or 5w/30 in the winter for my cage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman_40 Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 I always warm up the engine. In the winter when it isn't too cold I usually wait until the temp is showing on the gauge 40C/104F at least. When it is cold (-20C/-4F) I usually start it with the remote start and wait until I have at least 10C/50F inside the Jeep(my remote start is 2 way and can display inside temp). Engine has long reached operating temp at this point. Even with full synthetic oils, when it is real cold below -30C you have to not only warm up the engine but making sure your transmission, power steering etc is warm. If your PS isn't warm say good by to your PS hose. NOTHING works the way it should at -40. I usually let the bike warm up until the TStat opens(80C/180F) no matter what the temp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mekanix Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 In my mind, pumping all that REALLY thick oil thru cold oil passages is hard on the engine. This is, of course, my mind. Nothing closely resembling reality exists there. That being said, my commute is only 10 minutes. With FI, the engine runs fine at cold temps. My rule of thumb is keep it below 2k until I feel heat coming from the vents. Since I have about 5 minutes of neighborhood driving, by the time I hit the main road I got some heat. I had a classmate in high school when we had a big freeze and I think it got to around 15F. He had a tendency to just floor it cold. That winter we pulled his engine because he spun a bearing. His oil pump driveshaft was twisted until it broke in two. I imagine it was thick oil but I have no proof. Now when I start my car in the cold I imagine that poor little pump driveshaft in that engine and keep the rpm kinda low until I think the oil is a little warmer. Coolant temp is not the same as oil temp. I know the oil is actually colder than the heater, but at least it's getting warm by that time. Also, synthetic is much more desirable at low temperatures, so says bob the oil guy. bobistheoilguy.com Motor Oil 104 Part Four. It's not what we thought. Now let us finish talking about the differences of mineral verses synthetic oils. I will compare the same weigh or grade of oils showing that the operating viscosities are the same whereas the startup viscosities vary: Mineral oil: Oil type...Thickness at 75 F... at 212 F...at 302 F Straight 30..........250....................10..........3 10W-30...............100....................10........ ..3 0W-30..........There are none in this range...... Synthetic oil: Oil type...Thickness at 75 F... at 212 F...at 302 F Straight 30...........100...................10...........3 10W-30.................75...................10........ ...3 0W-30...................40...................10...... .....3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Knievel Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Generally, if it's that cold.... 1. The needle gets off cold. 2. The pipes stop blowing steam. I figure after either of those the motor is warmed up enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearXX Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 So with the cold weather setting in for us Higher elevation and Latitude guys, the question crossed my brain... How long should a person let there engine warm up before driving/Riding ? So say the vehicle has been sitting outside overnight and the temp gets down to 10 degrees. Or maybe even colder... I've seen below zero a few morning here lately. Car, Bike, Truck... newer or older engine... whatever, whichever... 30 seconds ? 1 minute ? Until the needle on the temp gage starts to Rise ? .... What do you do... or what have you been told is the best practice ? ... Second part... I wonder how long it going to take before a certain individual from Arizona chimes in with one of his classic comments? I don't wait. I start the car, and drive when it runs smooth. Cold at low RPM's ( idle) the oil pressure isn't that good to the top, and the head might not get the best lubricant. But don't push the pedal to the metal to get it hotter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RXX Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 I crank up the car, back it down the driveway at idle, swing around to the dog pen at idle, get out & release the hounds, then circle around to our long gravel drive and idle up it while the dogs circle the vehicle, then onto our little curvy one lane road. Then a couple of miles on a windy-assed little country road before hitting a tertiary road with 2 RR crossings on it then 1 mile of straight 40 MPH strictly enforced road, then the highway. No load, no revs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVLXX Posted January 6, 2011 Author Share Posted January 6, 2011 Well recently my work adopted a "30 second idling policy", which of course is no where near long enough to get the ice off of the windshield, but you might be surprised at how many people are trying to adhere to the policy with little or no regard for the safety of them or anybody else..... to me it's truly amazing, how much people will do just what they are told to do without using their own common sense. (Thank You Department of Energy Assholes!) Me I wait for some heat, something to defrost the windshield at least. As for the comment above about the twisted oil shaft, I believe it, and that's a good story. I too think that the oil is way to thick at below freezing to be pushing a engine hard. I also like the Datta posted... good stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomek Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Well Eric ,you should have been more specific in the O.P. Company vehicle a.k.a. " I don`t pay for fuel " ? The very first think to do when you show up at work is to start the engine up and bump the idle speed to 1000 rpm , only after that you go to the office , dispatch , drink coffee , etc . Who cares if it idles for 5-20 minutes ? Now trucks, real trucks . You are not suppose to start placing any load on the engine till you see oil temp gauge moving. Also idling at 600-700 rpm is big no- no ,something like 900-1000 rpm is more appropriate . Cold or warm . If your truck does not have oil temp gauge and it is not possible to bump idle speed it is not a real truck . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVLXX Posted January 7, 2011 Author Share Posted January 7, 2011 Well I didn't want to get to specific in the O.P. because I wanted it to be open for various possible engines and conditions.... I really want to know what people think or have been told is the best practice for starting their own engine, irregardless of whether it's a truck, car, or bike, and at various temperatures. Like for instance, once I was on a ride with Robin and his Aprilia... and he stated he had to let his bike warm up for at least 3-5 minutes before he road it..... every time... even when it was 70 degree out. Now... my question originated from the local low temperatures.... and watching everyone around me fire up there vehicles and leave in less than 30 seconds, when the temps were well below 20. So really, all answers and reasons pertaining Engine warm up practices are good responses in my book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianmacza Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Leaving a diesel engine to idle while warming up in the cab is all very well, but ;leaving it to idle while you jack off in the office for 20 minutes is a big no-no - that leads to diesel contamination of the engine oil because it sticks to the cylinder walls and passes the rings. I have seen almost new Volvo and Cummins truck engines that needed a complete strip/rebuild because of this. Gas engines run hotter usually, so bore washing isn't as much of an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackhawkxx Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Leaving a diesel engine to idle while warming up in the cab is all very well, but ;leaving it to idle while you jack off in the office for 20 minutes is a big no-no - that leads to diesel contamination of the engine oil because it sticks to the cylinder walls and passes the rings. I have seen almost new Volvo and Cummins truck engines that needed a complete strip/rebuild because of this. Gas engines run hotter usually, so bore washing isn't as much of an issue. So you are saying that you can't idle a diesel for more than 20 minutes? At work, I saw guys idle their truck for 10 hours waiting for their loads. Look at truck stops anywhere when it is cold. Just don't buy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomek Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 That why it is necessary to bump the idle speed to about 1000 rpm minimum . Idling at 600-700 rpm in big no-no. Increasing the load on the engine helps too , as ridiculous as it sounds turning ON the radiator fan actually helps here ( real trucks have this option ) . In couple of years trucks idling for 10 hrs will be thing of the past anyway . More and more trucks have auxiliary cooling / heating systems ,fuel prices being the reason. They are being powered by small generator or in some cases battery pack. Big 14-16 liters diesel burns about 1 gallon of fuel per hour while idling , at current fuel prices it gets expansive . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spicholy Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Now if you are talking diesels I can add another layer. I drive an Isuzu NQR at work. I turn the idle knob all the way up before starting. If not, it barely runs until warm. It also has to idle at high so it stays warm. If it idles at low idle speed, the engine actually cools down. It is sucking in more cold air than fuel needed to idle. If I am at a stop for more than a few minutes, I shut it off so it does not cool down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman_40 Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Diesels don't like cold no matter what. Up here any diesel that needs to run keeps running(-25C or colder) or is stored indoors. You can start them most of the time if they are plugged in or running a heater. But if they have a heater they are sucking your battery dry. I know quite a few people that have sold there diesels because they are a major pain. They are fantastic for work, towing etc but unless you need to do major towing it isn't worth having it here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianmacza Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Leaving a diesel engine to idle while warming up in the cab is all very well, but ;leaving it to idle while you jack off in the office for 20 minutes is a big no-no - that leads to diesel contamination of the engine oil because it sticks to the cylinder walls and passes the rings. I have seen almost new Volvo and Cummins truck engines that needed a complete strip/rebuild because of this. Gas engines run hotter usually, so bore washing isn't as much of an issue. So you are saying that you can't idle a diesel for more than 20 minutes? At work, I saw guys idle their truck for 10 hours waiting for their loads. Look at truck stops anywhere when it is cold. Just don't buy it. Buy it or not, its a given that extended idle at low RPM leads to bore washing, which contaminates the engine sump oil. This in turn leads to accelerated bearing wear and associated damage. When you have seen a big Mercedes or Cummins diesel engine less than a year old throw a rod thru the side of the block due to bore wash associated damage, and insurance refusing to pay due to "abuse", it becomes a VERY expensive overhead. Of course, if you have experienced differently, wonderful... I was in fleet management for a long time and have the data to prove my statement. no Google involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Dave Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 I always try to warm the Bird (and all my vehicles) up somewhat before moving out. The 340 Dart esp. Of course there are times that is impossible. As far as diesels go, I am with brianmacza, Tomek and XXRider. For all the years that I ran over the road, if I idled the truck, it was on a high idle. Even in the winter,I ran the A/C with a little heat blended in. This way, the compressor kicked the fan on and the temp stayed 175-180. If I didn't, the temp would go from 175 up till the fan kicked in at 210... and the temp inside the cab would vary accordingly. Ever wake up in the middle of winter, sweating because the temp was set while the water temp was 180, but now the water temp was 210? All of our trucks are programmed to go to high idle and engage the fan clutch when the PTO is engaged for loading or unloading. That took care of all the smoke coming out the exhaust pipe when they put it under load after an extended low idle, caused by the unburned lubricating oil in the fuel due to low combustion chamber temperatures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuffguyF4i Posted January 17, 2011 Share Posted January 17, 2011 I run synthetics in everything, which are great at low temps. I normally let the bike warm up long enough to get my gear on. For cars, i start them up and go. I just keep the rpms low till the gauge is reading a normal temp. It pisses people off in CT when i'm not mashing the gas at every read light, but screw them. They can't drive anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurora Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 For the CFE 738-1-1B gas turbine engines I operate, 2 minutes for warm up or oil in the proper temperature/pressure range and 3 minutes at idle for cool down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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