Mach12 Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 http://dontbescaredracing.com/ecta/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fast Eddy Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Would it not be ezer to go fast in a staight line and level line rather than fight the down force of the banking at Datona? you must lose energy compressing the suspension centifical forces and so on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlingBird Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 http://www.scta-bni.org/Bonneville/records/BNIrecs_bikes.htm Seems there was even a 350cc yamaha managed it back in 1973... but maybe that doesn't count because he didn't do it at daytona? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redbird Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 http://www.scta-bni.org/Bonneville/records/BNIrecs_bikes.htm Seems there was even a 350cc yamaha managed it back in 1973... but maybe that doesn't count because he didn't do it at daytona? It doesn't count because it was highly modified. Does the name "Vesco" mean nothing to you? Those guys on the salt aren't running stock anything unless it's a stock class. It doesn't say on the list you posted, but I guarantee that was in some streamlined class, and a Don Vesco prepped 350 Yamaha would be a screaming fucking motor. Regardless, you're so far from the point it's funny. The only source I found that says the V&M does 200mph is V&M, and I did look. You have a link to proof of what you say, or just 25 year old stats for highly modified bikes that have nothing to do with the present conversation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockmeupto125 Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 I don't recall ever seeing authentication of the supposed V&M claim. There's been some controversy over the issue. Supposedly they were building the bike for 205, but as I said, I've never seen authentication. Is there a current website? I recall them getting very close with a highly modified XX that was above and beyond what the 50 V&M Blackbirds were. The XX is pretty slippery aerodynamically with the right rider. Any trials that the folks here have done were certainly quite a ways above sea level, or not in optimal conditions. Perhaps Chris or Forrest's bikes would be much more productive if they found the best place to do that sort of thing. Anybody have Jack Valentine's number? That should clear things up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redbird Posted January 18, 2007 Share Posted January 18, 2007 Correction, it does say on the list you posted. He did in the the Streamlined/Modified engine class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDAZ XX Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 LMFAO... I've just been looking for proof for you BDAZ XX but it seems you already found it. You posted the same shit on another forum... you honestly believe that half a mile should be sufficient to reach 200mph? Hey dippy, I never have said that a 1/2 mile is enough to hit 200 mph(give me a break!). I said with a 100 mph runon and 3/4 of a mile run, a factory built 200 rwhp race bike cant hit it. On paper anything is possible, in reality, your full of shit and you are truely clueless!! The question was what gear is needed to hit 200mph! Unless you spend some serious 5 figure $$ on the XX, it is not going to happen! End of story! I've been around a long time (30 yrs) riding, racing and have gone through the XX from front to back as many longtime owners have and have yet to see a comfirmed 200 mph run with a stock bike! Maybe it would be a good idea to check out some land speed records then come back and post your findings before you start accusing people of being full of shit. Were talking about a CBR1100XX here. NOT a landspeed racer! The bikes you're talking about aren't geared for top speed, they're race bikes ffs... fookin part time bikers, i've shit em! OK little man, your showing that your truely clueless! Since when is a $250,000 factory built racing motorcycle NOT geared to top speed at a world famous high speed track? Have you any clue? Keep mouthing off with your big ol' 1 inch chickstrips there fast guy! Someday reality will set in. And if your ever in the neighborhood I'd be happy to show you how a part time biker kicks your ass on 2 wheels! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVLXX Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 I've been trying to find hard evidence of the true capabilities of our beloved XX for years, to no avail. I've also been through countless articles about aerodynamics and Land speed records. Once again with no real hard data in relation to our XX's. I've also seen, but don't have copy of, a picture of someones GPS unit reading about 182 mph, and if I recall correctly that was on a stock bike. What I also Know... is that with the right riding possition, bike set-up (including slight engine mods - PC2 and exhaust), and seat pack, the XX can hold side by side with a stock Busa at top speed. That's not to say that it can keep up with the Busa on the pull to that speed, but that once it was there... we held that way for over 2 miles. Why.... because I did it. I should also mention it took 3 passes to find that extra 8 mph out of body-english. But all that's really inconsiquential.... my point is, Aerodynamics is MONSTEROUS when you talking about 200 mph speeds....and eats up a average 90% of the working power. So with that in mind, I have to agree strongly with Joe's comment... The XX is pretty slippery aerodynamically with the right rider. Any trials that the folks here have done were certainly quite a ways above sea level, or not in optimal conditions. Perhaps Chris or Forrest's bikes would be much more productive if they found the best place to do that sort of thing. Now back to the he said / she said Shit throwing, reading between the lines, and putting words in poeples mouths............................................. carry on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlingBird Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Looks like the V+M site has disappeared but here's a little info on the bike. V & M Blackbird. The First Normally Aspirated Road Bike To Do 200 M.P.H. "When we decided to build a road bike to do 200 m.p.h. the Honda CBR1100XX was the obvious choice. Good streamlining and a strong stock motor were the basis for V&M's Steve Mellor to start work. Wanting to keep the bike flexible and user friendly, the stock carbs and engine balance shafts were left in, but the air box was modified to ram air. The bottom end of the engine was left stock with "Carrillo" rods fitted as "insurance". Power centres around the 1200 big-bore pistons and the extensively gas flowed cylinder head. Careful machining for correct squish and compression ratio and VMR profile camshafts are phased in for optimum power. Steve also put a lot of work into the stock C.V. carbs, for maximum drivability in conjunction with the ram air box. Fitted with a modified AKRAPOVIC race exhaust the engine produces in excess of 180 b.h.p. at the rear wheel, compared to the stock bikes at 135 b.h.p. Even though the V&M bike has in excess of 45 b.h.p. more than the stock bike, it is easier to ride with the immense torque spread making a very flexible and user-friendly motor. Official Honda results... CBR1200XX -182 RWHP 0 - 200mph - 9980 feet (1.85 miles) So as I said previously, no, you can't do the 200mph in 1/2 a mile, or 3/4 but 200mph on a bird is possible with 180RWHP Honda advertised the bike as being capable of 204mph but I can't find any figures to back this up... still, what's 4mph between friends Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDAZ XX Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Whats the percentage of power loss due to elevation? It would be cool to add that back into Chris and Forrest numbers. Hey someone pass me some popcorn. Its fun watching knowitall newbies make fools of themselves. And you can believe everything on the internet too! And a stock RC51 will do 205 mph in Minysoda!.....lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlingBird Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 I only just noticed this... The question was what gear is needed to hit 200mph! Unless you spend some serious 5 figure $$ on the XX, it is not going to happen! End of story! I've been around a long time (30 yrs) riding, racing and have gone through the XX from front to back as many longtime owners have and have yet to see a comfirmed 200 mph run with a stock bike Who mentioned anything about a stock bike.. the V+M bike was over 200bhp OK, I'll bow to your superior knowledge oh wise one... you're obviously right because you've been riding a bike for 30 years and Honda, V+M and the official timers were all lying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redbird Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Honda, V+M and the official timers were all lying. Yeah, people trying to sell you something would never do that. You believe a stock XX weighs 492lbs as well? I'm not saying they didn't do it, but if my only source were the manufacturer, I wouldn't be quoting it as gospel. There's zero other proof that I can find that the V&M will do 200mph. Hey, maybe they went by the stock speedo. That I would certainly believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexxus Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 I only just noticed this... The question was what gear is needed to hit 200mph! Unless you spend some serious 5 figure $$ on the XX, it is not going to happen! End of story! I've been around a long time (30 yrs) riding, racing and have gone through the XX from front to back as many longtime owners have and have yet to see a comfirmed 200 mph run with a stock bike Who mentioned anything about a stock bike.. the V+M bike was over 200bhp OK, I'll bow to your superior knowledge oh wise one... you're obviously right because you've been riding a bike for 30 years and Honda, V+M and the official timers were all lying. Hey Blingbird, how long have you had your V&M Bird you lucky dogg!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDAZ XX Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 READ the first post newbie! I saw a thread, I believe on this forum, about "Will a Blackbird go 200 MPH?". Some of the replies were about changing the gearing(sprockets). My question is. My 01 Bird is totally stock. Again I assume you, are just like all of us blingbling. You have 2 eyes and 2 ears and only 1 mouth. Theres a reason..................... think about it!! Read and listen to the experienced riders on this board and quit blowing wind and you might, MIGHT learn a thing or 3!! 200 mph will NOT happen with a XX of any caliber less than a full blown drag bike! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartonmd Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Edit: Nevermind... sometimes it's not worth trying to correct someone... Yes, my Nighthawk will do 350mph... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mach12 Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 WOW this it great... My bike makes 175 at the wheel, and to know that all I need is 5 more hp to go 200mph is awsome. All I need are some V Stacks for $300 and I'm there in the record books. Thanks for your great wisdom Blingbird... he he Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVLXX Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Whats the percentage of power loss due to elevation? It would be cool to add that back into Chris and Forrest numbers. Just a little over 2.25% for every 1000 feet of rise. So if they were around 5,000 feet they would be down about 12% on power compared to Sea Level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDAZ XX Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 Whats the percentage of power loss due to elevation? It would be cool to add that back into Chris and Forrest numbers. Just a little over 2.25% for every 1000 feet of rise. So if they were around 5,000 feet they would be down about 12% on power compared to Sea Level. I wonder what a 12% increase in power equates to in MPH for those 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockmeupto125 Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 I firmly believe that either Chris or Forrest's bike will top 2 tons under the right circumstance...that being good weather, sea-level altitude, and the place to get a couple runs in to sort out the aerodynamics. And both of those bikes are fully streetable drive-across-north-america-if-you-damn-please bikes. Bling, you're entitled to your opinion, but it flys in the face of reality. Then again, since when did the Irish begin to recognize reality? I've followed this issue since before V&M produced that bike, and the hopes of hitting 200mph with some basic mods was one of the reasons I chose to purchase the XX nearly 8 years ago after a year of research. There was never anything definitive...just a bunch of sourceless gobbledygook and hints by V&M. You sure can't find it in any record books. Maybe they got a one way run of 199.6 and felt justified in rounding up....nobody here knows. Maybe the dyno was bum and they were pushing 205hp, and did slip into the 200's. But 180hp, 200mph, and CBR1100XX don't all fit in the same sentence. BTW...if you haven't ridden one, do so if you get the opportunity. That will put a smile on your face for a couple days...or at least it did for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Dave Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 At Daytona..... 3/4 mile of straight??? At 150mph, how long would it take to cover that distance and what would you speed be at the end?? Not very long and not that much more. How long does a Bird take to go from 150 to 185 and how much distance does that cover?? It is just so much easier to change a sprocket and 'forget' to recal. the speedo. I won't tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northman Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 At Daytona..... 3/4 mile of straight??? At 150mph, how long would it take to cover that distance and what would you speed be at the end?? Not very long and not that much more. How long does a Bird take to go from 150 to 185 and how much distance does that cover?? Well, considering you can get up to 140 in the 1/4, and only 110 in the 1/8, a stock XX can easily get up to top speed in 1.5 miles. You could get really close in a mile, but that last little bit takes time. A race bike could easily gain 50mph in 3/4 of a mile if it was able. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlingBird Posted January 19, 2007 Share Posted January 19, 2007 At Daytona..... 3/4 mile of straight??? At 150mph, how long would it take to cover that distance and what would you speed be at the end?? Not very long and not that much more. How long does a Bird take to go from 150 to 185 and how much distance does that cover?? It is just so much easier to change a sprocket and 'forget' to recal. the speedo. I won't tell. The info on the V+M site, stated that their bird did a 130mph 1/4 and took a further 1.6 miles to reach 200mph BDAZ... for someone who (allegedly) races bikes, you don't seem to know a great deal about their setup. Anyone who thinks any track bike is geared for top speed, needs to take their nose out of the gas tank coz their head is obviously more mixed up than scooby doo. And just so you know... I'm 38, I started riding bikes when I was 6 years old and driving karts when I was 7. I did 140mph on a kart at 10 years of age and started racing them at 14. I was rally driving by 18 and at 21, I was building and tuning some of the fastest hot rods in the UK... and guess what... nothing I ever worked on or drove was ever geared for top speed, not even when set up for an oval. Your suggestion, that because a race bike is only geared to pull 190 at daytona, means that that's its maximum (horse power limited) speed, is ludicrous. Did it not cross your mind that the bike might just be geared to get round the circuit in the fastest possible time? I'm giving up up this now coz although the V+M XX figures may be incorrect (I have no proof to the contrary), it's like talking to a child who doesn't have a clue what he's talking about but resorts to name calling because doesn't know how else to express himself... stick to your ovals, BDAZ, they suit you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDAZ XX Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Stick to 4 wheels Bling! Not saying I know everything bling but I damn sure know the XX will NOT do 200 mph without some serious $$ in the motor! I also have some common sense about what works and what doesn't on different bikes. Road racing a bike is something that you just dont understand bling. Gears 1-4 get you in and out of corners as quickly as possible, thus giving you the best lap time. Dropping or adding a tooth or 2 is all it takes to fine tune the gearing at tracks like Infineon, Laguna Seca, Willow Springs ect, true road racing courses. Top speed and drafting at "Daytona" is where that race is won or lost. BTW Never been there, I'm a west coast boy and I dont do circle tracks/ovals anymore, just road racing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVLXX Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 Whats the percentage of power loss due to elevation? It would be cool to add that back into Chris and Forrest numbers. Just a little over 2.25% for every 1000 feet of rise. So if they were around 5,000 feet they would be down about 12% on power compared to Sea Level. I wonder what a 12% increase in power equates to in MPH for those 2. Years ago when Bill Elliot was standing Tall, and there was alot of talk about limiting the HP in NASCAR... someone did a speed - Hp - Cd analogy at that time. They basically stated that inorder for one of those cars to gain 1 mph in speed above 200 mph, that one of 2 things needed to happen. Either the motor had to produce and additional 7 Hp or they had to reduce the Coifficient of Drag by .01. So relating that to our bikes, that have horrible Cd's in comparision, can help to explian why brakeing the 200 mph barrier is such a Monsterous task, and why improving ones Aerodinamics can yeild huge gains. And also shows why I have stated, that Yes, a Non-aerodynamicly minded rider on a Stock Busa can be matched by a very slightly modified XX rider that knows what he's doing. Trust me, I had loads of fun telling him " there must be something wrong with your bike !" and letting him ponder. I let him struggle with that for 2 days, before explianing there was probably nothing wrong with his bike, and why. I firmly believe that either Chris or Forrest's bike will top 2 tons under the right circumstance...that being good weather, sea-level altitude, and the place to get a couple runs in to sort out the aerodynamics. And both of those bikes are fully streetable drive-across-north-america-if-you-damn-please bikes. Bling, you're entitled to your opinion, but it flys in the face of reality. Then again, since when did the Irish begin to recognize reality? I've followed this issue since before V&M produced that bike, and the hopes of hitting 200mph with some basic mods was one of the reasons I chose to purchase the XX nearly 8 years ago after a year of research. There was never anything definitive...just a bunch of sourceless gobbledygook and hints by V&M. You sure can't find it in any record books. Maybe they got a one way run of 199.6 and felt justified in rounding up....nobody here knows. Maybe the dyno was bum and they were pushing 205hp, and did slip into the 200's. But 180hp, 200mph, and CBR1100XX don't all fit in the same sentence. BTW...if you haven't ridden one, do so if you get the opportunity. That will put a smile on your face for a couple days...or at least it did for me. +1.... wish I could. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackhawkxx Posted January 20, 2007 Share Posted January 20, 2007 I have often thought how strange it is that a top fuel car can cover half the track (1/8 mile) at 275 mph but takes the other half of the track to go 330 mph (only 55 mph more). Oh, that is at 8,000 HP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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