Obby Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Today while riding I notice a severe shaking in the font end. The front wheel and handle bar begain making a squeeling noise and then a rough shake. When I got home I finally just jacked up the frontend with a floor jack under the oil pan. I grabbed the bars and shook the steering left to right... clunk, clunk. Not sure what it is, but the sound seems to be comming from the wheel. I tried isolating the wheel and couldn't get any side to side movement. It seems to be only happen when the wheel is suspended and I shake the handlebars left to right, WTF. I guess a visit to the local stealer is in order, DAMN! . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonW Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 Ugh, don't take it to the dealer. If you're not mechanically inclined, isn't there someone nearby that could help you? Based on the little info given, my first guess would be the front wheel bearings. There is an axle sleeve inside of the wheel that could be causing the noise even though there isn't any side to side movement of the wheel. Also, check the left caliper pivot bolt. I've heard of these working loose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrdxx Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 If the noise is as pronounced as you say, I would definitely recommend that you not ride the bike anymore. If you do take it to a dealer, truck or trailer it. You should be able to remove the front wheel; if you do that much, I think the source of the noise and vibration should be obvious. I'm wondering if it could possibly be a broken axle (hey, stranger things have happened) with each axle piece held in approximate position by the pinch bolts. Or it could be a loose rotor or caliper. Before tearing into anything, it might be worthwhile to do a thorough torque check of all the bolts in the area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in PA Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 I grabbed the bars and shook the steering left to right... clunk, clunk. Not sure what it is, but the sound seems to be comming from the wheel. I tried isolating the wheel and couldn't get any side to side movement. It seems to be only happen when the wheel is suspended and I shake the handlebars left to right, WTF. I guess a visit to the local stealer is in order, DAMN! . If you couldn't get the wheel to move seperately, sounds like loose and/or dented steering head bearings to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 16, 2006 Author Share Posted March 16, 2006 If the noise is as pronounced as you say, I would definitely recommend that you not ride the bike anymore. If you do take it to a dealer, truck or trailer it. You should be able to remove the front wheel; if you do that much, I think the source of the noise and vibration should be obvious. I'm wondering if it could possibly be a broken axle (hey, stranger things have happened) with each axle piece held in approximate position by the pinch bolts. Or it could be a loose rotor or caliper. Before tearing into anything, it might be worthwhile to do a thorough torque check of all the bolts in the area. I had some time last night to another look at it. All the caliper bolts are tight. I retightened the axel bolt and pinch bolts. Again when I lifted the front wheel off the ground and shook the handlebars quickly left and right, the clunking noise was still there. This morning I got on the bird to come into work (bad idea). Halfway down my block I felt an abrupt dragging (slowing down the bike) and scraping noise. It was really apparent that I should not ride into work on it. I turned around put her back in the coop. For the life of my I can't find where the noise and dragging is comming from. I seached visually everywhere, forks, calipers, axel, pads, steering head, all looks tight and good. As was stated, I should remove the wheel and inspect the parts individually. A couple of problems there. I don't have a Pitbull or anything like that. The jack I used is not stable enough to hold the bike up. So it's either the stealer or buy a pitbull and try to do it myself. Any thoughts on this. I have 1 day (saturday) that I can dedicate to fixing it, either by stealer or by myself. I need that bike working asap as it's my primary form of transportation. That ZX-14 is looking better and better . I have a laundry list of issues now with the bird. All very minor, but still exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squareman357 Posted March 16, 2006 Share Posted March 16, 2006 As was stated, it sounds like front wheel bearings, though the clunking when turning the wheel sounds like steering head bearings and I doubt steering head bearing would squeal or make the bike drag when riding in a straight line. You're going to have to take the front wheel off and check the axle and wheel bearings. Where do you live? I'm sure someone near you has some tools or a jack or whatever and would come help you out. If you were in the Chicago area, I would bring my jack and tools and help you take the front end apart to look for the problem... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 17, 2006 Author Share Posted March 17, 2006 As was stated, it sounds like front wheel bearings, though the clunking when turning the wheel sounds like steering head bearings and I doubt steering head bearing would squeal or make the bike drag when riding in a straight line. You're going to have to take the front wheel off and check the axle and wheel bearings. Where do you live? I'm sure someone near you has some tools or a jack or whatever and would come help you out. If you were in the Chicago area, I would bring my jack and tools and help you take the front end apart to look for the problem... Thanks buddy. I'm really fucked now. I called my local stealers today. They all full up and won't even offer an appointment to steal my hard earned money for over a week! I'm already going through withdrawls and pain after just one day of dealing with human cattle buses and ferries. I need my bird back!!! What would take me about 30 min. on the bird is now taking me close to 2 hours to get into work...ONE WAY. Not to mention the fun of it all. I live in Vallejo if anyone's around here. I doubt it though. Nobody would deliberately live here, especially if they need a bike mechanic . I do know my way around a tool or two. I just don't have the tools. At this point I'd stay up all night to get her back on both feet. She's just sooo heavy. I don't want to try to pull the wheel and end up dropping her side trying. I may just go out and charge a Pitbull tomorrow and pull the wheel. I'm just wondering if after I get the wheel off, I'll be able to pull the bearings. Do they need a special tool to remove/install? Ok, I have a headache now... :icon_wall: . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squareman357 Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 That's a good question. I know you need a puller for the steering head bearings, but I'm not sure about the wheel bearings...anyone? Bueller? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 17, 2006 Author Share Posted March 17, 2006 I guess I'm going to half ta find out the hard way. Hell, the birds not flying anytime soon anyways. If I can't get them out, I'll just drive all the hell over the place 'till I find somebody that will swap them out for me. Hard to believe nobody wants to earn some quick money in my town. 3 stealers, all to busy for me . I really need to get a backup bike. This sucks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rockmeupto125 Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 I take it you don't have a centerstand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman_40 Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 I take it you don't have a centerstand? If you have a center stand, got get yourself a floor jack for a car a small one will do. Use a piece of wood between the jack and the bottom of the bike. I don't have jack stands this is how I do it. If you do have a garage you can use tie straps from the bars to the roof to help support the bike so it's less likely to fall if anything happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFT Posted March 17, 2006 Share Posted March 17, 2006 Do you have any tie-down straps? A couple of bicycle hooks in the ceiling and straps from frame/handlebars to the hooks should get the front of the bike suspended. Oops, missed the response above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonW Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 Where is the "clunk" coming from.......the wheel or the stearing head? Did you spin the front wheel while you had it up in the air? Are you using a torque wrench when you tighten the axle? I'm still thinking wheel bearings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrated Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 As I work for a dealer, in sales, I understand your frustration about having to wait for a week to get the bike taken care of but, remember, you aren' their only customer. Our store, right now at this time of the year has an approx. two week waiting list to get a bike in. Everyone is taking their bikes out of winter storage, the weather is warming up and problems are being discovered on a daily basis with someone's bike. We sell approx. 1500 units a year in our store, so just the new bikes coming back in for the first service is something that keeps mechanics busy, much less the bikes that have been sold over the years and years of being in business. I know it's frustrating from your perspective, but the bottom line is.....first come first serve.....and apparently you weren't "first come". Our exception is that if someone is travelling and they are from out of the area and their bike breaks down, we will try to expedite the repairs and get them back on the road asap. Patience Grasshopper! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 18, 2006 Author Share Posted March 18, 2006 Where is the "clunk" coming from.......the wheel or the stearing head? Did you spin the front wheel while you had it up in the air? Are you using a torque wrench when you tighten the axle? I'm still thinking wheel bearings. Answers in order.... I think the wheel. I don't have a torque wrench, so I just gave it a really hard push (i'm really strong, too strong sometimes). I hope so... I looked at my factory manual today. Those wheel bearings need to be punched out by a 22mm "Special Tool". Again, I'm fucked. What I'm thinking is that I can get the wheel off, take it to whomever I can find to replace the bearings on the spot. The manual also suggested to check the wear on the axel, so that may need replacing too. I won't know until I get in there. I'll try the floor jack/suspension method. Those tools I do have. Worked fine on my 200lb. thumper, hope it will hold a big bird as well . If i'm asking for plastic on Monday, you'll all know I fudged it up bad. Thanks again for the advice guys... -Obby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willxx23 Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 If i'm asking for plastic on Monday, you'll all know I fudged it up bad. Dooooood......... it's not that bad........I took mine off under the carport at my apartment complex....just make sure you support it well under the oil pan and not the header pipe..........the pan is flat and easier to get it to sit nice and level .....the header pipe is rounded........lots a fun trying to get something to keep it level on........bricks worked pretty good.........oh and don't lean on it while it's off............ :icon_wall: :icon_doh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonW Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 Answers in order.... Yeah, but you forgot one. Floor jack on the oil pan as far forward and close to center as possible. Get the wheel in the air and spin it to see if it grinds. While it's up and you're sure that it's stable, turn it side to side to see if the clunk is inside the hub. Straps connecting to the rafters is good insurance, but I don't use that method due to a 16' ceiling. If you have to remove the wheel, it's a good idea to break the bolts loose while the wheel is on the ground to avoid tipping it off the jack. Do you have a service manual? Torque wrench? I'd recommend both, but I can help with the service manual part of it if you don't have one. If you can't find someone to swap out the bearings, you might be able to do it yourself if you can just get your hands on the replacement bearings. It's not rocket science, and makeshift tools can be used in place of the "special tools". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 18, 2006 Author Share Posted March 18, 2006 Answers in order.... Yeah, but you forgot one. Floor jack on the oil pan as far forward and close to center as possible. Get the wheel in the air and spin it to see if it grinds. While it's up and you're sure that it's stable, turn it side to side to see if the clunk is inside the hub. Straps connecting to the rafters is good insurance, but I don't use that method due to a 16' ceiling. If you have to remove the wheel, it's a good idea to break the bolts loose while the wheel is on the ground to avoid tipping it off the jack. Do you have a service manual? Torque wrench? I'd recommend both, but I can help with the service manual part of it if you don't have one. If you can't find someone to swap out the bearings, you might be able to do it yourself if you can just get your hands on the replacement bearings. It's not rocket science, and makeshift tools can be used in place of the "special tools". Ok, I got the front end jacked up by using some wood and a good floor jack I had on hand. Thanks for the advice about moving the jacking pivot points forward, that helped stabilize the front end some (I can network a global infrastucture, but by spendinding 16 years in learning that , my mechanical skills have suffered). Tomorrow I will be removing the wheel and getting a good look at what's going on inside the wheel. Actually looking forward to it . Does that make me a nut? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pug Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 Obby this what I use to remove the front end. You need an old car spare wheel in small size. The one I use is a 175/14. Since the bike sits on the tire with its bellypan and headers (and in this photo in the hub cup) is safe for the plastics. [attachmentid=348] In this photo my XX is not yet shimmed at the rear. If yours is, there is not enough room to slide all the wheel underneath, but still works. Do not forget to remove the front fender and the calipers (and don't let tem hanging from their lines - check photo again). If you cannot remove the bearings (sometimes a bitch), a half decent auto garage should do it easily. Good luck :icon_thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 18, 2006 Author Share Posted March 18, 2006 Obby this what I use to remove the front end. You need an old car spare wheel in small size. The one I use is a 175/14. Since the bike sits on the tire with its bellypan and headers (and in this photo in the hub cup) is safe for the plastics. [attachmentid=348] In this photo my XX is not yet shimmed at the rear. If yours is, there is not enough room to slide all the wheel underneath, but still works. Do not forget to remove the front fender and the calipers (and don't let tem hanging from their lines - check photo again). If you cannot remove the bearings (sometimes a bitch), a half decent auto garage should do it easily. Good luck :icon_thumbsup: Wow, where do you guys come up with this shit LOL. I'm getting the idea now. This is going to save me like 170 bucks for a pitbull. I'll get one eventually, but now is not a good time for me. All my vehicles are breaking at once. The bird is on the top of the list though. Who needs a car anyways . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in PA Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 Since you're not removing the forks, you can just use some stacked blocks, bricks, cinder blocks, etc. under the fork tubes and remove the wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 18, 2006 Author Share Posted March 18, 2006 Ok, got the front wheel off. What do you guys think . Left front wheel bearing looks like toast to me ... [attachmentid=349] Right wheel bearing... [attachmentid=350] Now it's time to beg my local stealer to help a brotha out. Off the the shop, wish me luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exskibum Posted March 18, 2006 Share Posted March 18, 2006 Ok, got the front wheel off. What do you guys think . Left front wheel bearing looks like toast to me ... [attachmentid=349] Right wheel bearing... [attachmentid=350] Now it's time to beg my local stealer to help a brotha out. Off the the shop, wish me luck! Good luck! With the seal partially obscuring the view of the bearings, it's hard to tell for sure, BUT . . . I don't like the look of the center spacer being out of line with the bearings. Is this becasue of bearing disintegration? One of those pics seems to show a bearing that's starting to come apart, but like I said, hard to tell for sure with the seals and vestiges of grease. I'm thinking you can sure tell with it in hand, though. My '97's front wheel is out, awaiting a tire swap, and taking a quick look at its bearings, I sure wouldn't swap you for yours. Like I said -- good luck, and let's hope you're back on the road with just a simple bearing replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 18, 2006 Author Share Posted March 18, 2006 A few more pic for postarity. Bird with it's feet up. [attachmentid=351] Left wheel bearing. [attachmentid=354] Right wheel bearing. [attachmentid=352] What's this that fell out of the left wheel bearing . Ehh, doesn't look important . [attachmentid=353] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obby Posted March 18, 2006 Author Share Posted March 18, 2006 Good luck! With the seal partially obscuring the view of the bearings, it's hard to tell for sure, BUT . . . I don't like the look of the center spacer being out of line with the bearings. Is this becasue of bearing disintegration? One of those pics seems to show a bearing that's starting to come apart, but like I said, hard to tell for sure with the seals and vestiges of grease. I'm thinking you can sure tell with it in hand, though. My '97's front wheel is out, awaiting a tire swap, and taking a quick look at its bearings, I sure wouldn't swap you for yours. Like I said -- good luck, and let's hope you're back on the road with just a simple bearing replacement. Oh yeah it's the bearings alrighty. The left one was completely disintegrated as you said. From what I could tell, they are supposed to be sealed bearings. The right one spins fine and is still sealed, I could barely turn the left one at all. When I did, metal came out . The stealer has my wheel and is going to have to order the parts. I just let them replace everything in there (dust seals, both bearings and inner sleeve). Total wasn't too bad, estimated at $130 bucks since I took the wheel of for them. Thanks again guys! Sometime it takes me a good kick in the ass to get moving . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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