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Removal of air injection system.


mrhemi
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Search "PAIR" and you should find plenty of info on the subject. It's pretty straightforward.

Here it is as short and simple as I can say it. Unplug the solenoid, remove it and the attached hoses. Buy rubber caps and hoseclamps. Cap off the 3 nipples and you are done.

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If you're going to perform this modification, I suggest you to exclude also the oil vent system (that is connected at the airbox, making engine breathing worse).

I did the same in my Blade (the engine layout is identical), using two simple high temp. rubber hoses.

You'll have to let the vent system be free to get out on atmosphere, and for the PAIR system you have only to connect the two small beaks together, creating a short circuit.

I've a pic of the works on Blade; it shows only the vent system, but the philosphy is clear. You can see also one of the two small beaks of PAIR, waiting to be connected in short circuit with the other one.

post-5404-1172127865.jpg

In this other attachment you can see a sort of guideline of the things to do.

post-5404-1172129074.jpg

Have fun !! :icon_wink:

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Just a quicky but can someone tell me whether the 97-98 carb bikes had the pair system as I did the plugs on my 98 a few days ago and their is nothing there except what seems to be the castings into the Cam cover whick has no holes or reeds in it and nothing on top either and from what I can gather from the manual only the 97-98 Cal bikes had Pair - is this true :icon_confused:

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Just a quicky but can someone tell me whether the 97-98 carb bikes had the pair system as I did the plugs on my 98 a few days ago and their is nothing there except what seems to be the castings into the Cam cover whick has no holes or reeds in it and nothing on top either and from what I can gather from the manual only the 97-98 Cal bikes had Pair - is this true :icon_confused:

Boh...

I cannot speak about '98XX 'cause I've never worked on it yet, but looking at this fiche (regarding the 98 coverhead) it seems that the PAIR inlet intakes are present (mark 3)

E__0100.gif

BTW... yesterday night I've done exactly this modification.

Herein after the pics relevant this operation...

My Bird waiting for me...

post-5404-1172215453.jpg

Lifting the tank we can access the airbox; next time I have to remember to do it without the tank full of petrol... :icon_biggrin::icon_whistle::icon_rolleyes:

post-5404-1172215460.jpg

Detail of airbox

post-5404-1172215467.jpg

Removing airbox we can access the coverhead and injection items. I wasn't so happy to find the engine so dirty :icon_sick: ; usually, my bikes are so clean... you can also eat on 'em :icon_lol::icon_evilgrin:

post-5404-1172215473.jpg

This sort of spider is the PAIR Valve, complete of hoses...

post-5404-1172215485.jpg

After removal of vent and PAIR pipes, the coverhead (finally clean !! :icon_wink: ) is in this way

post-5404-1172215512.jpg

You can recognize tha two PAIR intakes (behind) and the vent (in front)

Ok, this the moment to apply the new hoses; as I told yesterday, we have to make a short-circuit for PAIR and get a free-on-atmosphere hose for the vent

post-5404-1172215491.jpg

post-5404-1172215506.jpg

The vent pipes continues trough the injection manifold going on the rear of cylinder block, just over the crunkcase. In my experience (I made this modification on my Blade, used 90% on track), the vent amount is pratically negligible and doesn't need a dedicated tank.

post-5404-1172215518.jpg

post-5404-1172215479.jpg

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You can use PAIR to help pull blowby gas out of crankcase.Crankcase vent is actually on cylinder head cover.Pull out the guts of selenoid valve so it is alwayes in open position.Connect crankcase vent with selenoid.Plug in couple empty holes in the airbox.

That is all ,very simple.Lower the pressure in crankcase,the better=more power.

I`ve done this mod on R1,it actually builds negetive pressure in crankcase.If you remove oil filler cap and put piece of paper it gets suck in.

Some guys measured the vacum,it is about 1-1.3 psi,not much but better then nothing or some positive pressure.

Ram air systems builds positive pressure at speed,in stock form crankcase vent is connected with air box,so it can build positive pressure in crank case.

It is very retarded,but Honda has to do it due to emmision regs.

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You can use PAIR to help pull blowby gas out of crankcase.Crankcase vent is actually on cylinder head cover.Pull out the guts of selenoid valve so it is alwayes in open position.Connect crankcase vent with selenoid.Plug in couple empty holes in the airbox.

That is all ,very simple.Lower the pressure in crankcase,the better=more power.

I`ve done this mod on R1,it actually builds negetive pressure in crankcase.If you remove oil filler cap and put piece of paper it gets suck in.

Some guys measured the vacum,it is about 1-1.3 psi,not much but better then nothing or some positive pressure.

Ram air systems builds positive pressure at speed,in stock form crankcase vent is connected with air box,so it can build positive pressure in crank case.

It is very retarded,but Honda has to do it due to emmision regs.

I guess my only question on this would be...

What's going to happen to the inside of your exhaust pipes over time ?

With the introduction of the heavily oil laden crankcase air straight into the super hot exhaust gases. I seriously don't there is enbough heat and unburnt oxygen to completely burn of the Oil particles that would be pressent. So considering the heavier and cooler crankcase air is going to get sucked or pushed to the wall of the tube, due to the internal friction of the pipe and the pressure caused by the exhuast wave coming out of the cylinder. I would imagine that over time you would see a build-up of material on the inside of your exhaust tubes. And probably not directly at the exhaust header either, but rather about 2" and 8" down inside the tube where the tube bends at an almost 90 degree angles.

Airflow through a tube is extremely sensitive to wall friction, so any build-up inside those exhuast tubes would drasticly effect the flow rates of the exhaust and therefor drop the engines performance.

Oh I'm sure you'll se a gain on the dyno immediatly after the modification, but after a few thousand miles of service, I wouldn't be surprised if your Dyno numbers dropped below the pre-mod numbers.

Now if you've got enough money to replace your exhaust header every so often... well who am I to stop you ?

I'll leave mine hooked up to the air box for now, but I be eagerly waiting to see the comparisons of the 3 Dyno charts after your first 5,000 miles. (Pre mod, immediate post-mod, and 5,000 mile post mod.)

Good day, :icon_biggrin:

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You can use PAIR to help pull blowby gas out of crankcase.Crankcase vent is actually on cylinder head cover.Pull out the guts of selenoid valve so it is alwayes in open position.Connect crankcase vent with selenoid.Plug in couple empty holes in the airbox.

That is all ,very simple.Lower the pressure in crankcase,the better=more power.

I`ve done this mod on R1,it actually builds negetive pressure in crankcase.If you remove oil filler cap and put piece of paper it gets suck in.

Some guys measured the vacum,it is about 1-1.3 psi,not much but better then nothing or some positive pressure.

Ram air systems builds positive pressure at speed,in stock form crankcase vent is connected with air box,so it can build positive pressure in crank case.

It is very retarded,but Honda has to do it due to emmision regs.

I guess my only question on this would be...

What's going to happen to the inside of your exhaust pipes over time ?

With the introduction of the heavily oil laden crankcase air straight into the super hot exhaust gases. I seriously don't there is enbough heat and unburnt oxygen to completely burn of the Oil particles that would be pressent. So considering the heavier and cooler crankcase air is going to get sucked or pushed to the wall of the tube, due to the internal friction of the pipe and the pressure caused by the exhuast wave coming out of the cylinder. I would imagine that over time you would see a build-up of material on the inside of your exhaust tubes. And probably not directly at the exhaust header either, but rather about 2" and 8" down inside the tube where the tube bends at an almost 90 degree angles.

Airflow through a tube is extremely sensitive to wall friction, so any build-up inside those exhuast tubes would drasticly effect the flow rates of the exhaust and therefor drop the engines performance.

Oh I'm sure you'll se a gain on the dyno immediatly after the modification, but after a few thousand miles of service, I wouldn't be surprised if your Dyno numbers dropped below the pre-mod numbers.

Now if you've got enough money to replace your exhaust header every so often... well who am I to stop you ?

I'll leave mine hooked up to the air box for now, but I be eagerly waiting to see the comparisons of the 3 Dyno charts after your first 5,000 miles. (Pre mod, immediate post-mod, and 5,000 mile post mod.)

Good day, :icon_biggrin:

I agree, but to that... Has anybody ever hooked it up like he's talking about, but had an oil seperator, like from an air compressor, in the middle of the hose? I know this kind of thing has been done on several cars that put lots of oil into the intake (TBI CSB, and Neon) with some success, but has anybody done it on the bike? It seems that there'd be plenty of room under the tank for a small seperator?

Mike

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Just a quicky but can someone tell me whether the 97-98 carb bikes had the pair system as I did the plugs on my 98 a few days ago and their is nothing there except what seems to be the castings into the Cam cover whick has no holes or reeds in it and nothing on top either and from what I can gather from the manual only the 97-98 Cal bikes had Pair - is this true :icon_confused:

You might have gotten something different Down Under....probably not the same emissions specs that we have.

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WEll,honestly I don`t think carbon build up would be and issue,for couple reasons.

Oil consumption is almost zero in XX,so blowby gas is very low on oil.

Rotaries inject oil on the face of rotor,they run massive overlap ,in certain rpms fresh charge with oil is pulled into exhaust ports.They don`t have a problem with carbon build up,or cats packing.

Run Synthetic oil,it hardly burns anyway or wd40 :icon_evilgrin:

Two strokes introduce massive amount of oil into exhaust chambers ( I know it is diff. oil ) ,they do build up carbon in exhaust pipes,but you`ll get more then 5 k miles before it needs to be serviced.So I think 5 K miles in case of XX is waaay to low.

Carburator cleaner dissolves carbon in heart beat,no need to replace your pipes,,,,,,,,,,,,

I`m not inventing anything here, crankcase scavenging systems that use exhaust pulses have been aruond since 5 BC.

I think you guys are just too worry and pussy. :icon_twisted:

Anyway,I`ve already piped my R1 like that,XX will be next( once I`m done with not so high quality valves and seats),what do I have to loose ?,pipes clean up,if it works ,cool,if I`m wrong,I`ll just spend quality time cleaning my pipes with very healty carb cleaner,,,,,,,,

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I agree, but to that... Has anybody ever hooked it up like he's talking about, but had an oil seperator, like from an air compressor, in the middle of the hose? I know this kind of thing has been done on several cars that put lots of oil into the intake (TBI CSB, and Neon) with some success, but has anybody done it on the bike? It seems that there'd be plenty of room under the tank for a small seperator?

Mike

Very good idea there..... actually don't know why I didn't think of that, considering I've painted a few cars and trucks and you have to have an inline oil seperater.(although there aren't real cheap either.) But yes that would work great.

Good job.

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  • 4 months later...
WEll,honestly I don`t think carbon build up would be and issue,for couple reasons.

Oil consumption is almost zero in XX,so blowby gas is very low on oil.

It's low, because nothing is pulling the vapor out besides the engine, which is likely burning it during power stroke. If you start extracting oil from the crankcase without anything to light it off, there is going to be residue in the exhaust. There is oil vapor and condensate in the bottom end. It will come out if you increase the scavenging effect.

Rotaries inject oil on the face of rotor,they run massive overlap ,in certain rpms fresh charge with oil is pulled into exhaust ports.They don`t have a problem with carbon build up,or cats packing.

Rotaries have a very high exhaust gas temperature. Modern catalyst equipped rotaries have oil metering pumps to reduce the amount of oil that makes it out of the engine. Not the same as a piston reciprocating engine with it's comparatively low exhaust gas temperature.

Run Synthetic oil,it hardly burns anyway or wd40 :icon_evilgrin:

So this is worse. You have liquid oil in the pipes. Mess.

Two strokes introduce massive amount of oil into exhaust chambers ( I know it is diff. oil ) ,they do build up carbon in exhaust pipes,but you`ll get more then 5 k miles before it needs to be serviced.So I think 5 K miles in case of XX is waaay to low

Two stroke oil burns off fairly well in exhaust chambers unless the mixture is too great. Modern two strokes have much less oil emissions, or rather, can have much less, depending on the oil mixture and engine use.

---

IMO, if you want to use the exhaust reed valves for scavenging of the engine crankcase, buy a oil seperator ("catch can") and fit it.

TSR used to build one which was designed specifically for the blackbird. Sat atop the transmission.

In my opinion, there is minimal gain to be had here, for the effort and/or cost. Spend the time in the gym and lose seven pounds of mass.

Or ride naked.

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Just my two cents here, numerous auto genius condone crankcase evacuation. Smokie and Grumpy both have books about the effects. Can be high gains. All Pro Stock Engines run vacuum pumps on the crankcase. Can run low tension rings for low drag and seal better, less leak down also.

I have run the system that Grumpy designed on my race engines with low tension single compression rings. I have made as much as 30 inches vacuum in the crankcase. Makes for an interesting sealing test on the pan and valve covers. That is why they are for the most part made from billet materials on the pro stock circuit.

google search reading

Thanks Tomek I will do this and record map.

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Interested to see your results, Stan.

With regard to your comments, and I respect your opinion:

Racing engines and especially drag racing engines, are built with a very loose clearance, and as such, could stand to benefit from substantial crankcase vacuum. They are seeing more crankcase pressure than your average street engine due to the loose cylinder-to-piston clearances. I say the two are very different animals.

If, as Tomek says, there is little oil blowby, it would stand to reason that the rings on many XXs are particularly efficient at their job. Being a Honda engine, which typically have high precision, I would believe this. If this is the case, the larger reason for running heavy crankcase vacuum to control heavy amounts of combustion gases in the crankcase due to loose clearances would not apply to the typical XX.

I'm not saying that the benefit is not there, because I'm not. I'm saying it's a substantial effort for most users to implement and maintain (I suspect the reeds will become gummed up in short order)

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Interested to see your results, Stan.

With regard to your comments, and I respect your opinion:

Racing engines and especially drag racing engines, are built with a very loose clearance, and as such, could stand to benefit from substantial crankcase vacuum. They are seeing more crankcase pressure than your average street engine due to the loose cylinder-to-piston clearances. I say the two are very different animals.

If, as Tomek says, there is little oil blowby, it would stand to reason that the rings on many XXs are particularly efficient at their job. Being a Honda engine, which typically have high precision, I would believe this. If this is the case, the larger reason for running heavy crankcase vacuum to control heavy amounts of combustion gases in the crankcase due to loose clearances would not apply to the typical XX.

I'm not saying that the benefit is not there, because I'm not. I'm saying it's a substantial effort for most users to implement and maintain (I suspect the reeds will become gummed up in short order)

Negatory, all the engines I have built were tight clearances. The concept described to me was the oil would fall out of suspension in a vacuum better than pressures. Less hydraulic braking with the crank and rods hitting the oil droplets. If high vacuum the oil droplets drop straight out where if no vacuum will stay suspended and cause drag.

But after thinking about it over night I am not sure this will lower the readings. All the evac systems I have dealt with had connections in the exhaust to convert velocity into vacuum with an angled checkvalve,,,just like the reeds in the pair system.

It was also connected into the manifold not the aircleaner.

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  • 4 weeks later...
You can use PAIR to help pull blowby gas out of crankcase.Crankcase vent is actually on cylinder head cover.Pull out the guts of selenoid valve so it is alwayes in open position.Connect crankcase vent with selenoid.Plug in couple empty holes in the airbox.

That is all ,very simple.Lower the pressure in crankcase,the better=more power.

I`ve done this mod on R1,it actually builds negetive pressure in crankcase.If you remove oil filler cap and put piece of paper it gets suck in.

Some guys measured the vacum,it is about 1-1.3 psi,not much but better then nothing or some positive pressure.

Ram air systems builds positive pressure at speed,in stock form crankcase vent is connected with air box,so it can build positive pressure in crank case.

It is very retarded,but Honda has to do it due to emmision regs.

I guess my only question on this would be...

What's going to happen to the inside of your exhaust pipes over time ?

With the introduction of the heavily oil laden crankcase air straight into the super hot exhaust gases. I seriously don't there is enbough heat and unburnt oxygen to completely burn of the Oil particles that would be pressent. So considering the heavier and cooler crankcase air is going to get sucked or pushed to the wall of the tube, due to the internal friction of the pipe and the pressure caused by the exhuast wave coming out of the cylinder. I would imagine that over time you would see a build-up of material on the inside of your exhaust tubes. And probably not directly at the exhaust header either, but rather about 2" and 8" down inside the tube where the tube bends at an almost 90 degree angles.

Airflow through a tube is extremely sensitive to wall friction, so any build-up inside those exhuast tubes would drasticly effect the flow rates of the exhaust and therefor drop the engines performance.

Oh I'm sure you'll se a gain on the dyno immediatly after the modification, but after a few thousand miles of service, I wouldn't be surprised if your Dyno numbers dropped below the pre-mod numbers.

Now if you've got enough money to replace your exhaust header every so often... well who am I to stop you ?

I'll leave mine hooked up to the air box for now, but I be eagerly waiting to see the comparisons of the 3 Dyno charts after your first 5,000 miles. (Pre mod, immediate post-mod, and 5,000 mile post mod.)

Good day, :icon_biggrin:

I just changed oil, "consumption" ( oil does vaporize) over the distance of 11 K miles was 0.2 qt.

Yes,bike went 11 k miles w/o oil change ( shell Rotella 5w/40) ,it actually "looked" O.K.,if looks mean anything,,,,,,,,,

Bottom line- my PAIR mod works,oil does not get sucked in into exhaust pipes,totall cost 0.00$ :icon_whistle:

Cheers

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  • 1 year later...
You can use PAIR to help pull blowby gas out of crankcase.Crankcase vent is actually on cylinder head cover.Pull out the guts of selenoid valve so it is alwayes in open position.Connect crankcase vent with selenoid.Plug in couple empty holes in the airbox.

That is all ,very simple.Lower the pressure in crankcase,the better=more power.

I`ve done this mod on R1,it actually builds negetive pressure in crankcase.If you remove oil filler cap and put piece of paper it gets suck in.

Some guys measured the vacum,it is about 1-1.3 psi,not much but better then nothing or some positive pressure.

Ram air systems builds positive pressure at speed,in stock form crankcase vent is connected with air box,so it can build positive pressure in crank case.

It is very retarded,but Honda has to do it due to emmision regs.

Tomek,

What would be the configuration to utilize the PAIR system to pull negative pressure in the crankcase?

I like the idea of keeping either negative or neutral pressure on the crankcase just for the sake of not having seal blow by and keeping as clean of engine as possible.

Best regards, Sean

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