Serious Engine Problem ZX6E (ZZR600)

[MrBadExxample]

My brother recently picked up a 2004 Kawasaki ZZR600, aka ZX6E w/ 3500 miles.

Shortly after getting the bike, he changed the oil & filter, air filter, cleaned/lubed the chain. In short, the sort of maintenance one should do after buying any used motorcycle. Anyhow the bike ran great, easy to start, smooth idle, lots of power. Basically it ran just like it should. Then about 500 miles later something very bad happened.....

He was riding to work one morning and noticed a huge cloud of white smoke behind him. Then his oil pressure light came on. He pulled over, but is unsure how long he rode with the oil pressure light on, maybe 30 seconds? The gasket at the base of the oil filter had bulged out, and sprayed out all the oil. For reference the oil filter is the same one used on the XX, and it's located behind the header pipes on the front of the engine.

His wife brought him a new oil filter and oil. So on the side of the road he cleaned off as much oil as he could, installed the new oil filter, refilled the engine and restarted it. But the engine is not the same, it runs rough and has a very pronounced tick. However, he was able to ride the bike home. Several days after this incident I listened to the bike, the tick is very noticeable, it's RPM dependent. Using my stethoscope I heard the tick the loudest at the bottom of the engine. Also the volume of the tick changes a little when the engine is loaded - bike on centerstand, in gear, applying rear brake.

There's basically two questions I have about this situation:

1. Why did the oil filter gasket bulge out and spray out oil?

2. What is causing the new tick in the engine?

Before reading my theories below, think about it yourself. I don't want my ideas to influence yours.

.

.

.

.

.

1. I'm 99% positive my brother re-installed the oil filter correctly - not cross threaded or installed too tight. Also I'm 99% positive the Puralator Pure One PL14612 oil filter was not faulty. My theory is that the crankcase was not properly vented, either the vent tube was kinked or plugged. My brother says he wasn't able to blow air through the tube connecting the airbox and the crankcase. But he's a motorcycle newbie, and may not have puffed on the right tube. And I haven't had a chance to remove the tank and check this myself.

2. I think the tick is from a rod bearing. It's loudest at the bottom of the engine. In a low (no) oil situation would the rod bearings be the first component to deteriorate? The tick could also be a valve stuck open, which would certainly make the engine run rough.

The bike is now at a local shop, so in a couple of days we should know more. In the meantime y'all have any thoughts, ideas or things to check?

Thanks in Advance.

[Northman]

My theory is that he did not remove the old oil filter seal, and that is what caused his oil leak.

I agree with you that it's most likely a rod bearing noise. Obviously a major repair.

[jcrich]

My theory is that he did not remove the old oil filter seal, and that is what caused his oil leak.

I agree with you that it's most likely a rod bearing noise. Obviously a major repair.

+1 That is what I thought of as soon as I read it. Not that I would know anything about something like this.

[CxBXR]

Well since the bike is in the shop Im sure they will find out what's wrong with it exactly,

I would think spun/burned rod bearing from it running low on oil.

[shovelstrokeed]

+1 on the leaving the old gasket in place.

+1 more on it probably being a rod bearing, although that really shouldn't make the engine rough unless it is really chewing on the crankshaft.

Don't run the thing any more.

You can probably get a new factory rod and a full bearing set at not too much money and I'd send the crankshaft to Falicon and see if they can save it. Might as well send the whole rotating/reciprocating assembly over to them, this way they can balance the stuff. Price would still probably be less than a new, factory crank.

[Redbird]

Another vote for the double gasket scenario. BTDT, embarrassingly enough. Luckily in my case it caused no major damage, but the cloud of white smoke sounds very familiar.

[MrBadExxample]

Thanks for your input.

I too thought that the old gasket was left on the engine case. My brother doesn't think that happened, but frankly if you don't know to look for something like that, it's easy to miss.

Ed, He stopped riding the bike as soon as we suspected a faulty rod bearing. Still I'm not sure why it runs rough. It's most noticeable when revving the engine, it doesn't rev up as zippy as before. Undoubtedly this engine will get a leak down and compression test. I'll try to remember to post the results. Besides suspect rod bearings, there could be other problems. In fact I would be surprised if other problems weren't happening.

As a side note, my brother and I are lucky to live really close to a terrific independent motorcycle mechanic, Bee Johnson. He was a dealer service manager and mechanic for over 20 years. He builds race bikes for several racers in our area. IIRC, one of his bikes still holds the fastest lap record at Summit Point. Anyway, he's got the bike now.

[slowrideCX]

You say he only ran the bike for about 30 seconds after the light came on yes no ? Was he crankin on it or putting? I don't know if that would be long enough to trash a bearing. Also I don't think that would cause it to run rough. Sounds more like a stuck value to me. Or a wiped cam lobe that would be the first place to see damage from loss of oil due to heat. The rod and main bearings tend to hold a small amount of oil to help avoid major damage in a very short time. lol with it.

[rockmeupto125]

It seems odd to do that much damage so quickly.

For the cost, I'd start searching for an engine to drop in, rather than repairing the old one.

[gharknes]

My guess here is a valve stuck open allowing pressure into the sump which blew out the oil seal, you now have a sick engine, strip and rebuild either way.

[CxBXR]

Here's the secret to fixing a stuck valve (not bent) without going into it.....................................

......................... :icon_shhh: SSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHH :icon_shhh: 30:1 two stroke engine oil run about 1/4 tank through it if there is a valve stuck it will free it guranteed.

[slowrideCX]

Here's the secret to fixing a stuck valve (not bent) without going into it.....................................

......................... :icon_shhh: SSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHH :icon_shhh: 30:1 two stroke engine oil run about 1/4 tank through it if there is a valve stuck it will free it guranteed.

Thats a good idea :icon_clap:

You could do like my Boss did when we were trying to fix a stuck valve on a 4 wheeler at work 1 day

Smack it with a hammer........... :icon_wall:

I am not kidding he hauled off and smacked that bitch needles to say that did not fix the bike.

For such a smart man he makes me wonder sometimes.

[Pete in PA]

I'd say rod bearing also.

When the 900RR is wheelied to much it oil starves at the pick up and smokes rod bearings.

The cams will go for a while without pressure using just residual oil.

If the crankcase isn't breathing the oil filter is not where it would blow. I suspect 2 gaskets also.

I hope the Purolator filter wasn't defective, that's what I use.

[MrBadExxample]

It seems odd to do that much damage so quickly.

For the cost, I'd start searching for an engine to drop in, rather than repairing the old one.

Agreed on both points.

My brother isn't sure how long he rode the bike with oil squirting out the filter, or with the oil pressure light on. He guessed 30 secs from the time he saw it, till the time he found a place to pull over. It could have been longer, no one really knows. The area we live is mostly rural, which can be interpreted to mean we commute on country highways at 80 mph or so.

Kawasaki made the ZX6 virtually unchanged from '93 to '04, used motors should be plentiful. A local independent mechanic we both trust is going to remove and inspect (partially dismantle) the engine. We're both anxiously awaiting his diagnosis. But I wouldn't be surprised if low miles used motor becomes the answer.

On a side note, the timing of the catastrophe is giving my brother a serious case of sport bike withdrawal. He rode a DR650 for awhile before getting the ZZR600, his first sport bike. Since he first got on it, he's loved it. The DR650 just doesn't cut it anymore.

[Ronnie]

Wasn't the ZZR known for eating cams?

[Para045]

Wasn't the ZZR known for eating cams?

I think that was the 1100's

[sykotek-xx]

Yes it was the 1100's, I had one. ZZR-1100 or ZX-1100 depending on what side of the atlantic you are on.