97 Reg./Rec

[Red J]

Subject: 97 XX, 42K miles.

So, I've been having intermittent charging problems...

Can't see it too well, but the base of the terminals in the regulator are crispy, too. Just where you'd expect them to be.

Wonderful. I have an 01- regulator, I guess I'll get to wiring that in and see how she works.

[airborneXX]

Guess I should start looking for a new one also :icon_think:

[Red J]

I forgot why I posted this in the first place:

Be careful, when you disassemble. If the plug does not wish to come out, you may consider leaving it until you have a solution in hand. Mine is not willing to go back together. Bike is dead in the water with this broken.

So be advised.

[Red J]

Seriously thinking about going this route:

http://members.cox.net/wdgah/vfr_connector_repair.htm

And getting the new RR from Honda with the fins.

[exskibum]

I have a new Yamaha R1 R/R for the recommended R/R mod for the '97 or '98 XX (and maybe later years, as well, but I didn't check -- I'm thinking there's an extra wire or three on the FI models, but that they can be wired together). It's the 2001 R1 R/R (part no. 4JH-81960-01-00) that is most recommended for this mod. I bought it from Gary at University Motors (so you know this is the best price available), and I have the black and white print out of the mod procedure somewhere here (see below for the link to the mod procedure, including color pics).

My '97s R/R is not the least bit fried (only 23,000 miles and few very short hops which tend to increase the load on the R/Rs). If anyone is interested, I'll sell the finned R1 R/R I got a couple months ago for the price I paid, and send along the print out for that mod. I paid $53.80, and will sell for PayPal of that price, including immediate shipping within lower 48. PM me if interested.

It's an easy mod and in addition to the R1 R/R, all you need is 5 simple spade connectors, some electrical tape and solder, and two bolts that are slightly longer than the ones holding the stock R/R in. I checked, and found that it is almost impossible to get the R1 connector that plugs in as a unit to the R1 R/R (unless you're lucky at a junk yard), so the article's wiring with spade connectors is the way to go. (Since the XX connector is slightly different, and in any event is usually fried, single spade connectors may be your default fix even if you go with the anemic XX replacement R/R . . . and I think you're going to be paying more for that under designed XX R/R too.)

Here's the article on the mod: http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/about/bikes/...eg_replace.html

[Red J]

I'm sure someone will take you up on the offer, but I'm wiring in the late XX regulator that I already have here.

I'm not hot on the idea of the R1 regulator, just because I don't have faith in the wire connection. The lack of positive retention would make me nervous enough to just fork over the money for the repair harness and the replacement XX regulator (redesigned, by the way). Having secure wiring on the bike, esp. where dealing with unfused connections, is pretty important in my book.

But to each his own.

[99Birdman]

I'm not sure what you mean by lack of positive connection. Once you individually shrink wrap each of the spade connectors to the r/r they aren't going anywhere but I certainly understand the added confidence of the actual snap connector. As you said, each to his own. I do have one question. I was under the impression the newer r/r's have a black wire that several people have hypothisized it's function but isn't on the earlier models. I believe someone had trouble getting the newer r/r to work without it connected. I'd be interested to know if it really is a problem and, if so, how you get around it.

Good luck

[exskibum]

I do have one question. I was under the impression the newer r/r's have a black wire that several people have hypothisized it's function but isn't on the earlier models. I believe someone had trouble getting the newer r/r to work without it connected. I'd be interested to know if it really is a problem and, if so, how you get around it.

Not sure if this answers your question, but when you posted it, I was reminded of this, from the link I posted above:

For EFI model Hondas, you will have eight wires, not 5. The DC power leads (red and black) are doubled up for some reason. Just connect the two of them to the corresponding colour lead from the R1 plug. That leaves one other lead, which, according to the Blackbird wiring diagram is blue. This is for sensing starting and if there is another wire (total 9) the other is there for headlight-on sensing. These are there to increase output when the lights are on, and stop charge when starting. They have been proven to NOT help the later bikes with RR failures. You can safely leave this wire unconnected as it is not powered. Just remember to tape over the end and tuck it away so you don't have a loose wire floating around.

There's a link on that page about why a R/R goes out, what bad shit can happen and what signs foreshadow the failure. Pretty interesting: http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/about/bikes/...a/dead_reg.html

[Red J]

It's been some time since I've consulted the wiring diagram for the later bikes, but as exskibum quoted, I recall it being tied to the starting circuit as a ground.

What purpose that serves, other than to negate the charging circuit, I have no idea.

---

Regarding the spade connectors:

Loose spade connectors have a dimple on the female end, and a corresponding hole in the male end, to lock the connector together. This is their primary mechanical lock.

Spade connectors in a terminal block lack this locking function, because with multiple spades you're going to play hell getting them all apart at once. The connector provides the lock.

Using these kinds of terminal spades independent of a terminal block (with it's inherent locking function) leaves only one securing method, the clamp force on the connectors, which isn't what they're designed to do. The clamping is to ensure electrical connection, not to ensure that the connector doesn't become disconnected.

[99Birdman]

For EFI model Hondas, you will have eight wires, not 5. The DC power leads (red and black) are doubled up for some reason. Just connect the two of them to the corresponding colour lead from the R1 plug. That leaves one other lead, which, according to the Blackbird wiring diagram is blue. This is for sensing starting and if there is another wire (total 9) the other is there for headlight-on sensing. These are there to increase output when the lights are on, and stop charge when starting. They have been proven to NOT help the later bikes with RR failures. You can safely leave this wire unconnected as it is not powered. Just remember to tape over the end and tuck it away so you don't have a loose wire floating around.

There's a link on that page about why a R/R goes out, what bad shit can happen and what signs foreshadow the failure. Pretty interesting: http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/about/bikes/...a/dead_reg.html

I have the black wire disconnected on my '99 when I installed the R1 unit, so I knoqw what you mean. It works fine with the harness side wire taped over when adding an r/r that doesn't use it. I just seem to remember someone posting at the time they had trouble the other way around (trying to use an r/r with the black wire with a harness that didn't). Probably talking out my ass though.

[Pete in PA]

What happened to our reg/rec post in the useful threads section??????

In a nutshell I also got a plastic connector for the R1 and my installation looks (is) totally factory.

[Red J]

I have the black wire disconnected on my '99 when I installed the R1 unit, so I knoqw what you mean. It works fine with the harness side wire taped over when adding an r/r that doesn't use it. I just seem to remember someone posting at the time they had trouble the other way around (trying to use an r/r with the black wire with a harness that didn't). Probably talking out my ass though.

I'm interested to hear about this, if you find the original info. I was planning to peruse the FSM and ground the wire if it's originally to ground in normal operation.

[bajjer9]

I have a new Yamaha R1 R/R for the recommended R/R mod for the '97 or '98 XX (and maybe later years, as well, but I didn't check -- I'm thinking there's an extra wire or three on the FI models, but that they can be wired together). It's the 2001 R1 R/R (part no. 4JH-81960-01-00) that is most recommended for this mod. I bought it from Gary at University Motors (so you know this is the best price available), and I have the black and white print out of the mod procedure somewhere here (see below for the link to the mod procedure, including color pics).

My '97s R/R is not the least bit fried (only 23,000 miles and few very short hops which tend to increase the load on the R/Rs). If anyone is interested, I'll sell the finned R1 R/R I got a couple months ago for the price I paid, and send along the print out for that mod. I paid $53.80, and will sell for PayPal of that price, including immediate shipping within lower 48. PM me if interested.

It's an easy mod and in addition to the R1 R/R, all you need is 5 simple spade connectors, some electrical tape and solder, and two bolts that are slightly longer than the ones holding the stock R/R in. I checked, and found that it is almost impossible to get the R1 connector that plugs in as a unit to the R1 R/R (unless you're lucky at a junk yard), so the article's wiring with spade connectors is the way to go. (Since the XX connector is slightly different, and in any event is usually fried, single spade connectors may be your default fix even if you go with the anemic XX replacement R/R . . . and I think you're going to be paying more for that under designed XX R/R too.)

Here's the article on the mod: http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/about/bikes/...eg_replace.html

I would like to point out it is not necessary to use spade terminals/cut your existing harness...a small screwdriver will help facilitate removal of the existing connectors from the plastic shell connector case...I use an R1 R/R and I still have the stock connector case...If I weanted to go back to stock I could quite easily (which is why I didnt cut the wires on the R/R)

[Obby]

Red J, I though you couldn't use an '01 reg/rec. on a '97 Didn't someone fry all their bulbs when they tried that?

[bajjer9]

Red J, I though you couldn't use an '01 reg/rec. on a '97 Didn't someone fry all their bulbs when they tried that?

hmmm that may be true for the 99+ but I can personally vouche for the carbed XX...mine works fine and had my stator not gone out and taken the Reg/rec with it would probably still be going strong

[Red J]

I have an XX regulator, not an R1 regulator. Someone tried this already?

[bajjer9]

I have an XX regulator, not an R1 regulator. Someone tried this already?

I tried running a 99 R/R on my 97...failed miserably...blew out both headlights the instant I used em...R/R was giving out a steady 18v...still dont know why...it was brand new out of the box...i chalked it up to the black wire not being connected because thats the only difference between the wiring of a 97 vs a 99 (as far as the reg/rec goes)...using an R1 unit now

I started a thread on it several months back

[exskibum]

I also got a plastic connector for the R1 and my installation looks (is) totally factory.

Now THAT sounds like THE clean installation, Pete. Where did you get the plastic connector? Junk yard? An unsuspecting neighbor's unprotected R1 after dark?

Gary (at University Motors) was unable to order a new one (I suppose I could've gotten the whole wiring loom, though).

Bajjer's solution might be worth looking into, as well, but it sounds like he hooked up the R1 R/R with XX connectors that were extant on the XX before the mod, but without benefit of the male plastic plug holding those connectors.

[99Birdman]

I have an XX regulator, not an R1 regulator. Someone tried this already?

I tried running a 99 R/R on my 97...failed miserably...blew out both headlights the instant I used em...R/R was giving out a steady 18v...still dont know why...it was brand new out of the box...i chalked it up to the black wire not being connected because thats the only difference between the wiring of a 97 vs a 99 (as far as the reg/rec goes)...using an R1 unit now

I started a thread on it several months back

THanks, James. That was the info I was referring to. Is it possible the newer r/r's use the black wire as some kind of triggeer to regulate output?

[matey_peeps]

mmm mmm mmm mmm mmm. Toasty.

Dat sux, yo.

[Red J]

Dat sux, yo.

I should fucking sell it.

[matey_peeps]

Dat sux, yo.

I should fucking sell it.

Well if it doesn't meet your needs anymore that is.

[Red J]

I tried running a 99 R/R on my 97...failed miserably...blew out both headlights the instant I used em...R/R was giving out a steady 18v...still dont know why...it was brand new out of the box...i chalked it up to the black wire not being connected because thats the only difference between the wiring of a 97 vs a 99 (as far as the reg/rec goes)...using an R1 unit now

The black wire should be run to +12VDC switched.

Mine works. Without the wire run, it does climb to excessive voltage. With the wire connected to +12VDC, it supplies voltage consistent with the FSM spec. The wire needs to be switched (as it is on the 99- bikes) so that it will not drain the battery.

I realize you're onto the R1 regulator now, but in case someone else looks for this info, there you are.

[Wario]

I have a new Yamaha R1 R/R for the recommended R/R mod for the '97 or '98 XX (and maybe later years, as well, but I didn't check -- I'm thinking there's an extra wire or three on the FI models, but that they can be wired together). It's the 2001 R1 R/R (part no. 4JH-81960-01-00) that is most recommended for this mod. I bought it from Gary at University Motors (so you know this is the best price available), and I have the black and white print out of the mod procedure somewhere here (see below for the link to the mod procedure, including color pics).

My '97s R/R is not the least bit fried (only 23,000 miles and few very short hops which tend to increase the load on the R/Rs). If anyone is interested, I'll sell the finned R1 R/R I got a couple months ago for the price I paid, and send along the print out for that mod. I paid $53.80, and will sell for PayPal of that price, including immediate shipping within lower 48. PM me if interested.

It's an easy mod and in addition to the R1 R/R, all you need is 5 simple spade connectors, some electrical tape and solder, and two bolts that are slightly longer than the ones holding the stock R/R in. I checked, and found that it is almost impossible to get the R1 connector that plugs in as a unit to the R1 R/R (unless you're lucky at a junk yard), so the article's wiring with spade connectors is the way to go. (Since the XX connector is slightly different, and in any event is usually fried, single spade connectors may be your default fix even if you go with the anemic XX replacement R/R . . . and I think you're going to be paying more for that under designed XX R/R too.)

Here's the article on the mod: http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/about/bikes/...eg_replace.html

+1 on this - works good, and cheap! I have personal experience that it works...

[bajjer9]

I tried running a 99 R/R on my 97...failed miserably...blew out both headlights the instant I used em...R/R was giving out a steady 18v...still dont know why...it was brand new out of the box...i chalked it up to the black wire not being connected because thats the only difference between the wiring of a 97 vs a 99 (as far as the reg/rec goes)...using an R1 unit now

The black wire should be run to +12VDC switched.

Mine works. Without the wire run, it does climb to excessive voltage. With the wire connected to +12VDC, it supplies voltage consistent with the FSM spec. The wire needs to be switched (as it is on the 99- bikes) so that it will not drain the battery.

I realize you're onto the R1 regulator now, but in case someone else looks for this info, there you are.

Well thanks Red, I still have the brand new 99 one and if i hadnt of chopped the wires already I would have sold it...Now I know how to make it work if the yammie unit ever fails!