wadem Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 Went for a drive yesterday about 45 min and everything was ok. Pulled in the drive way and shut her down. about 3 min had to start it back up again and just a ticking noise. So I checked the battery voltage and got 11.5. So over night it said on the battery tender and this morning it read 13.25 volts but as soon as I turned the key it droped to 12.3 volts. It started up fine then the volateg was at 14.75 volts at very fast idle (around 2,100rmp) but started to drop as the idle droped. settled down to like 13.3 volts. if I reved the engine it went up to like 14 volts. So does this sound like a dead battery? The battery has been in the bike sense 2001. Now I always take the battery off in the winter and bring it inside but last year I forgot until like mid Feb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redxxrdr Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 I think so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBBXX Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 The battery has been in the bike sense 2001. Replace it now, ask questions later. marty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted September 28, 2006 Share Posted September 28, 2006 The voltage levels at those RPMS is correct, so your charging system appears to be working correctly, but I'd say your battery was definitely toast. Replace it now and save yourself some headaches later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted September 28, 2006 Author Share Posted September 28, 2006 Just went out and got a new ytx12-bs for $75.95cnd. charging now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted September 29, 2006 Author Share Posted September 29, 2006 Update After 24hrs of not touching the bike the voltage droped to 12.6 from 12.9. I have no alarm on the bike or anything. The only think I changed this year was I added a hid system about 6 months ago. Is that normal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmike Posted September 29, 2006 Share Posted September 29, 2006 Update After 24hrs of not touching the bike the voltage droped to 12.6 from 12.9. I have no alarm on the bike or anything. The only think I changed this year was I added a hid system about 6 months ago. Is that normal What type of charger (& amperage) did you use on your new battery? It doesn't sound like you fully "bench charged" it... What year bike..? Your clock uses a miniscule amount of juice; not enough to drain .3 volts overnight. I doubt the HID conversion has anything to do with the issue - unless there's some sort of short in an "always-live" wire, but I seriously doubt it. I did the HID (Hi/Lo) conversion to my '99 and have had no charging issues. Static voltage stays between 13.3 - 13.9; drops to 12.6 -12.8 when starting, and floats between 13.9 - 14.4 under normal operation. BTW, the HID system is not engaged during starting; it's on a seperate (illuminated) switch. The HID current draw is less than the OEM 55w bulbs (there is a brief surge when ignited). Oh yeah, I do keep it on a Battery Tender almost all the time... I typically get five years out of a battery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted September 29, 2006 Author Share Posted September 29, 2006 I charged it up with a walmart brand battery charger that is like a battery tender (1.2amp at fully output then drops down when it thinks it is charged). Bike is a 2001 and I got the battery yesterday. So today I put it on a 5amp charger for like 30 min and then on a steady 1amp charger for 2 hours. Maybe the walmart charger is cutting out too early in the charging cycle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted September 30, 2006 Author Share Posted September 30, 2006 Ok so I just got back from a 30 min ride. I check the battery and it reads 12.5v wait like 20 sec now it reads 12.6v and after another min it reads 12.7v. What is going on here? The battery in my voltmeter is dying would this cause a bad reading? When the bike is running I check the battery and it read like 14.5v. I am hopping it is just the tester. This is a veru good voltmeter paid like $100 for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redxxrdr Posted September 30, 2006 Share Posted September 30, 2006 Just did a quick check of voltages on my 01 Yuasa battery. Standby 12.6 volts, drops to 12 volts ignition on, fuel pump off. Dropped below 9 during start. Charging quickly comes up to 14.6 volts. This is with a idle of 1400 rpm. I have always set mine idle a little high to assist in charge. Measurements made with a Fluke 87 III meter, calibrated last month. If you are concerned with the bike loading the battery, try charging the battery, then let it sit overnight disconnected from the bike. It should measure somewhere around 12.6 volts. Was this a Yuasa battery or another brand? Does it have a manufacture date? A Yuasa rep told me that the sealed battery for the XX is shipped from Japan filled. You could get a OLD new battery if the store had slow turns on inventory. Also checked my Magna, 4 year old battery. 12.6 standby, 12 volts with ignition on. 10 volts at start. Charging at 13.8 volts. Your numbers seem good. Try the disconnected test for a couple of days. If it drops near 12 volts, you may have a bad battery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted September 30, 2006 Author Share Posted September 30, 2006 Just went out and checked again after 1 hour it reads 12.35 volts. So I disconnected it from the bike and it now sits on a 1.5amp automatic battery charger from walmart. This battery is brand new so from what I have read it should read around 13v. the only reason I can think for the quick drop from 12.7 to 12.35 in 1 hour would be that the battery cooled off a little. Last night before bed it was at around 13v this morning at 15c it was at 12.8 before the ride. When running the voltage seems right but I wonder if amps the bike s putting out are high enough to charge the battery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmike Posted September 30, 2006 Share Posted September 30, 2006 You definitely need to fully "bench charge" that battery... it sounds like you haven't done so yet. If your new WM charger puts out 1.2 amps, and the battery is rated for 10 amp hours, charging for 8 hours & 20 minutes should bring it to full capacity. The Honda shop manual ('99-2000) calls for charging rates as follows: 0.9 amps for 5~10 hrs (slow charge - preferred), 4.0 amps for 0.5 hour (quick charge). The OEM battery specs: Capacity - 12V - 10AH Current Leakage - 0.2mA max Voltage (@20*C/68*F) Fully Charged - 13.0~13.2V Needs Charging - Below 12.3V Your voltage (engine running) is fine (14.+V), so I don't think you have an alternator or regulator problem. Personally, I never use a trickle charger/battery tender to initially charge a new battery. I always use a standard sized automotive charger capable of charging at 2.0 amps or slightly less (1.75 amps) for as long as it takes to reach a full charge. A safety circuit prevents over-charging, and an intergral voltmeter permits monitoring during the process. Trickle chargers & tenders are really intended for maintenance of a charged in-service battery. Any charging (of a new battery) is better than merely filling with electrolite, installing, and hoping the alternator will fully charge the battery while riding - not that anybody would really do this, of course... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted October 1, 2006 Author Share Posted October 1, 2006 My walmart charger is rated at 1.5 amps. I left it on until the light went green indicating fully charged at which point it went into maintain mode and even then left it on over night. I am going to check current leakage tmw after work. Could the charging system be putting out enough voltage and not enough current? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmike Posted October 1, 2006 Share Posted October 1, 2006 My walmart charger is rated at 1.5 amps. I left it on until the light went green indicating fully charged at which point it went into maintain mode and even then left it on over night. I am going to check current leakage tmw after work. Could the charging system be putting out enough voltage and not enough current? Just a hunch at this point... but, can you use a different charger? I'm not sure I'd trust the WM unit entirely. I have at least six batteries on tenders at any given time, and I've learned that they don't all always charge at the advertised rate - there are variables, and it can make a difference. The most frequent issue is slight "under-charging" (below the rated level, and more time required... even a long extension cord can contribute to such a problem) but for some reason, "green" lights notwithstanding, the batteries involved never seem to get fully charged. A session on my automotive charger usually solves the problem. The other issue tends to be slight "over-charging" - either a failure of the "protection/float" circuit, or a damaged cell/plate that won't hold the appropriate charge level to trigger the circuit. I'd trust a voltmeter reading over a tender's "green" light. Test "at rest" and "under load". If you still have problems, take it back to the store and advise them that it won't hold a charge. They should load test it in your presence, and subsequently replace it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted October 1, 2006 Author Share Posted October 1, 2006 After charging it and having it off the charger for about 12hrs it reads about 12.9v turning on the key drops it to like 12.3 and during starting it will go down to like 10v and shoot right back up to 14.5v once started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redxxrdr Posted October 1, 2006 Share Posted October 1, 2006 Those voltages sound correct. The 01 book shows the Alternator output at 460 watts. It also says that full charge is 13 to 13.2 volts and needs charging is below 12.3 volts. I assume this is no load voltage. We use 12 volt gel cells in our X-ray products. They will sometimes read a high steady state voltage, but have no capacity under load. I think you are OK. If the battery does have a TOP charge ( higher voltage with limited starting capacity) it may get better with use. You didn't say if your battery was a Yuasa or a alternate. Just wondering since I will be changing mine out this year. Yuasa has always been good for me. Other brands have not always been as good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted October 1, 2006 Author Share Posted October 1, 2006 Yeah it is a Yusa. I was thinking about getting a better charger like a BatteryMINDer or battery tender. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianmacza Posted October 1, 2006 Share Posted October 1, 2006 My Yuasa battery needed charging at under 2 amps for a whole day before I put it on the bike. If you read the carcass of the battery they mention that the max input charge should be 2A - if you put in 4A or more you risk buckling the plates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flitemdic Posted October 1, 2006 Share Posted October 1, 2006 The numbers are good, and Brian's right. Looking at a newer or different charger might just be the ticket, the other thing about the numbers trending up a little is going to be a product of normal lead/acid battery recharging, it will tend to give out a little more power as it sits a little while- assuming the plates are good and the acid is fresh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted October 1, 2006 Author Share Posted October 1, 2006 Ok so I put a new battery in the battery tester. Hook it up to the battery and start the bike. Voltage goes up to 14.5 but after like 2 min it drops to 12.5 and ends up at like 12.1 if I rev the engine to 4 grand it only goes up to 12.38. So I guess I now need to test if it is the stator or rectifier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted October 4, 2006 Author Share Posted October 4, 2006 After checking the ohms using the method in the shop manual it is reading .4 The book says it should be between .5 and 2 I am going to check the voltages coming off the stator after lunch. They should be reading around 50v right? I printed the trouble shooting guide and am going to follow that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lois Posted October 6, 2006 Share Posted October 6, 2006 After checking the ohms using the method in the shop manual it is reading .4 The book says it should be between .5 and 2 I am going to check the voltages coming off the stator after lunch. They should be reading around 50v right? I printed the trouble shooting guide and am going to follow that. So....what did you find? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadem Posted October 6, 2006 Author Share Posted October 6, 2006 The voltages went up and down like crazy. the higest I saw was 40v's but most of the time it was around 9v's testing at the stator. When doing this test the bike should be running right? Also does it matter what end of the plug you put the voltage meter test probes. Not sure I was doing this test right as I have done no electical testing before. All the wires coming out and going into the rectifier look fine no burning. On my 2000 the rectifier is very big with fins on it. Wish I had some around here with a bird I could check just to see what the number should be. I have a freind who is going to double check my work when he gets into down on the 14th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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