gharknes Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 My bike intermitantly grinds into 1st gear and has problems with 2nd and 3rd, very very loud clonking, other times it slips in almost silently. Today I went of hard in 1st - the passage to 2nd was a nightmare, it dropped into neutral then wouldn't engage 2nd, grinding grinding then eventually with a loud grinding clonk got 2nd, the bike doesn't seem to drag the clutch, on the center stand 1st gear clutch in the wheel remains still although thats not to say that the clutch engages correctly all the time, 1st gear when it clonks and grinds does move the bike forward slightly. I am going to bleed the clutch and clean the push rod tomorrow, is there anything else i can check while i'm in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rockmeupto125 Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 You don't need to do anything with the clutch cylinder. You need to get the bike to somebody that knows what they are doing. It is past the capability of the Saturday mechanic to deal with anything that makes grinding noises inside. With bad luck, you have a damaged clutch. With worse luck, you have damaged a transmission gear(s). Don't try riding it...you are courting a locked up drivetrain and rear wheel, which is hard to stabilize under the best of conditions. Sorry to sound brusque or harsh. Nobody else this year, please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman_40 Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 You don't need to do anything with the clutch cylinder.You need to get the bike to somebody that knows what they are doing. It is past the capability of the Saturday mechanic to deal with anything that makes grinding noises inside. With bad luck, you have a damaged clutch. With worse luck, you have damaged a transmission gear(s). Don't try riding it...you are courting a locked up drivetrain and rear wheel, which is hard to stabilize under the best of conditions. Sorry to sound brusque or harsh. Nobody else this year, please. +1 I'd be taking it to someone who knows what they are doing. It doesn't sound like something you could adjust/clean. We definatly don't need someone to go down over Xmas holidays. Take it to the pros and hope there is nothing seriously wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gharknes Posted December 25, 2005 Author Share Posted December 25, 2005 what i have discovered is if i let the revs drop between changes it is ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rockmeupto125 Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 Its hard to understand immediately what you are trying to say. If you have only grinking noises or noises of gears having a hard time meshing when you are trying to shift, then your diagnoses of pulling and cleaning the clutch pushrod is a very good guess....perhaps the clutch is not fully releasing, and that is one reason for it not to. But if you have grinding that occurs under regular driving, or gears that simply refuse to change, my previous advice stands. Can you shift easily through all the gears with the engine off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beondwacko Posted December 25, 2005 Share Posted December 25, 2005 Sounds like a syncro problem. If you force things, you'll bend a shift fork and then you'll be wishing you had brought it to someone who knows better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gharknes Posted December 26, 2005 Author Share Posted December 26, 2005 I think it is definately clutch related, if I change gears slowly letting engine revs drop and wait a second or two it slips into gear easily, also on idle my clutch is making some noise when i engage and disengage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rockmeupto125 Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 Well...did you get that done yet? Did it help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gharknes Posted December 26, 2005 Author Share Posted December 26, 2005 removed clutch slave and cleaned push rod, it was dirty but didn't make a difference. When the bike is on the center stand ticking over at 1000 revs, when i pull in clutch and slowly push down gear lever to select 1st gear it grinds in and jumps the rear wheel forward, once in gear the rear wheel only moves when i let out the clutch, during the selecting process there is something turning that shouldn't be so the clutch must be dragging somehow, perhaps one of the plates is warped but not enough pressure to turn the drive train once in gear but when in neutral is rotating the main shaft in the gearbox, this would explain symptoms, is the clutch difficult to change ? I have stripped car engines and gearboxes etc but not bikes. From the manual it looks like the clutch is a series of plates all pressed together by the pressure plate, do you have to change them all or just a warped one if found ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrdxx Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 A normally functioning motorcycle clutch can still transmit some power even when disengaged, due to some stiction between the plates and the viscosity of the oil, and is not necessarily an indicator of a clutch problem. The usual indicator of a failing clutch is one that slips under load when fully engaged. The motorcycle transmission is not synchromesh because of size and weight constraints, but uses a set of dogs and dog slots to match gear speeds and transmit power. The good news is the use of dogs allows for clutchless up and downshifts; the bad news is that clutchless shifting, if done without some technique to match gear and engine speeds, can eventually round off or undercut the teeth on the dogs, making for balky shifts or causing the bike to jump out of gear. You are the best judge if mileage and wear and tear is contributing to your symptoms. Technique may also be at play here. In your last post you mention disengaging the clutch and SLOWLY pressing the lever to select first gear. Don't try to ease into gear. When you are selecting a gear stab the shift lever with authority. If the transmission makes a solid clunk and goes into gear, I wouldn't worry about it further. If it continues to be balky, you have issues with the transmission gears or shift forks, and need to find a reliable repair shop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gharknes Posted December 26, 2005 Author Share Posted December 26, 2005 cheers for that very knowledgable post, i am having it looked at next week, my mechanic said very similar to you. The other thing I have noticed is if at idle and in first gear with clutch lever in - there is a ticking sound that can be felt in the chain, the clutch is also noisy in neutral and the sound changes when i let the clutch on and off. I run with fully synthetic 10-40 oil changed last week, there's 30k kilometers on the bike and every thing else runs very well. The worrying thing is the 1st to 2nd gear shift, it gets neutral sometimes and is then very difficult to get into 2nd from there while moving, it really grinds and the gearshift lever kicks back, i can force it into 2nd with a very loud clonk, it just isn't normal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Posted December 26, 2005 Share Posted December 26, 2005 it doesn't sound normal at all ... while the XX's are not know for velvety smooth 1st and 2nd gear shifts, it should not be a chore to get it in. Clunks and thuds are normal, grinds and clanks are not. Metal on metal sounds are bad .. take it to a shop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2equis Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 Sounds like a syncro problem +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gharknes Posted December 28, 2005 Author Share Posted December 28, 2005 couple more observations When the bike is cold the gears go in without a sound, it seems to get worse as it hots up Could be related to the recent oil change I put in fully synthetic and it seems to have made it worse, I read somewhere that fully synth in a bird can cause or make the gearchange bad - it could be the oil motul 10W 40 http://www.motul-asiapacific.com/thailand/.../4stroke08.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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