Mithrandir

Ah, that explains it. Sounds like shops in Oz - if you just buy the parts they charge you full retail, but if you get them to install it, you get a discount because the profit margin is in their labour costs instead. All understood now.

Try looking at adjusting the throttle cables. Sounds like they're a bit loose. Normally just a lock nut and then finger tightened thread that adjusts the cable. IIRC the XX setup is a twin cable, so you want to check on the cable that opens when you twist the throttle open as the target for adjustment.

Swampy - where'd you get those prices quoted from. For the valves, I've never seen anything within $20 of that quoted on any website. Pretty much everyone stays within $10 or so of RRP.

Ahh.. shit... Sorry forgot to add links to my original articles on it. Here you go: How to tell if your r/r is about to die Changing the Honda r/r Everything you need to know. I should update with info from Pete's post.

Speed99, The work is not that hard to do. It is mainly a time thing, particularly for someone that has not done it before. Almost all the tools you will already have in a standard toolkit. My valves and springs are turning up hopefully later in the week, so I'll fully document everything. Plenty of photos etc. Cost. Depends on where you get stuff from I just bought a heap of stuff in Oz because with the exchange rate it is about half the cost of buying the same kit here in the US. If you're doing it yourself, figure on spending about $300 in round numbers - $160 for valves, $110 for springs, rest on new fork oil, tools if you're missing anything, etc.

THat has to be one of the most brain-dead comments I've read on suspension in a long time. You are honestly trying to tell people that hydraulic lock is caused by springs? You really have zero clue what you are talking about. Please, before you spout any more "wisdom" on suspension, go jump on a stock VTR and pull up moderately fast on a slightly bumpy piece of road. Say some inner-city road would be sufficient to demonstrate. When you stop, you should be able to stare at the position of the front suspension without getting off the bike. The forks will be fully compressed. It will only very slowly return to full extension after about 5 seconds. Why? well as the front compresses, it cannot rebound fast enough. The standard valve holes, coupled with the stock shimstack, are too small to permit any fluid travel required for fast action required to handle any sort of bumps in the road even with rebound set to the softest setting. Even placing a heavier spring on there is not going to help matters at all because the heavier spring will attempt to push it back to full extension faster than the stock spring, and because oil cannot be drawn through the valves fast enough it will lock the fork at the current position. A heavier spring only makes the problem worse. The only way to solve this problem is to modify quite drastically the shimstack and use bigger ports on the pistons.

Got a preferred site where would I find good info about the Marine units? (apart from Garmin's site direct)

Alpha, you should try the same thing on a stock VTR to see just how bad the Honda setup is and why everyone claims the valving is so horrible. If you don't get thrown over the handlebars with the front dive due to lack of front spring then you end up like a hot-rod when the front hydraulic locks at the bottom of its travel.

Ok guys, seems we're missing a GPS thread here, and I'm in a shopping mood ($2500 tax return - yeaaaaaahhhhhaaaaaaaaaa guess what that's being spent on baby!). Been looking around at the various Garmin models. Looking for recommendations. I do a lot of loooong distance touring on the XX so ability to cover large areas of the country are a requirement. Also, Some detailed maps of the destination city are needed too. Typically I only visit one or two cities on a trip, so number of detailled map stored is not a real huge issue. Visible area on screen is a good thing too. I like to know what's coming up 2-3 turns from the one I'm about to make. Route planning and other bells and whistles are not a high requirement. Major requirement is weather protection. This bike gets ridden in all sorts of weather - much of it many hours at a time in rain. If it can't handle doing a lap of the pacific ocean, I'm not interested. Thoughts on usability of colour v B&W screens? Gut feeling says B&W will be far easier to read while on the move/in traffic etc. Right now, I'm leaning towards the Map 176 or GPS V. Suggestions?

This has been discussed before, but last I remember, noone has managed to put up a map for the setup. My pipe and PCIII should be turning up at the end of the week so I'm going to be needing maps shortly. Two questions: - Was it the euro Micron slipon map that others were using? - I'll be doing a proper dyno setup if there is no map available. I'm going to get two maps made - all out power and economy (for touring). This will cost me around $300 to do (full day on a dyno). For that cost, I don't really want to just dump the maps on the net for anyone to download, but if folks are interested in chipping in $5-10 or so I'll forward the maps on. I figure there's only 20 or 30 people that have this combo, so I don't want to make a profit, but I'd like to help pay for some of the time on the dyno too. Out of interest, how many would be interested in this?

Ratio is dependent on the linkage and swingarm length. On my VFR400 is was about 2.8 or so. The VTR was about 3.4 and the RSVR is around 2.1. If you want to jack the rear up that far, I think you would be better off looking at different link lengths rather than the spacer. The link only needs to change by one or two mm to have huge changes in the rear. I remember on my VFR that I shifted the hole by about 4 mm and the bike looked like it was nose-diving into the ground :???: Fixed that quickly! Then played around with spacers etc to get the roughly right setup. but there was certainly a point where with the spacers that the swing-arm was too close to the bottom limit of travel and the angle was causing the chain to jump off the sprocket under power. In the end I was running about 45mm at the axle over stock, but I was also running a 17in rear rather than the stock 18in, so I had to make up for that.

You need to be careful about raising the rear too much. 15mm at the shock is going to translate to about 50mm at the axle. At that point you run serious potential of having the chain jump off the sprocket due to the angles formed between the swingarm and frame. It is advisable never to go over about 30mm raise at the axle.

Randy, I'd suggest not dropping the front if you can help it. As the front drops, you loose clearance with the fairing. Raising the rear will give you more clearance, but mainly around the exhausts, not the front of the fairing, which is the first thing to scrape.

TSR UK site is: http://www.tsr-uk.com They don't have the kit there, but I've sent an email off to their sales dept. Been doing some pricing of doing it myself. If Ive got the forks for free, should be able to do it for about $700 all up. Vortex clamps, heli/genmar/2bros bars, new brake lines and possibly new calipers. Need to machine new axle (possibly), and adjustment plates for the calipers to go with the different size brake rotors (or maybe buy bigger rotors to suit).

I got offered a set of RC51 forks in good condition for free today. :shock: Who was looking into doing this conversion? I wanted to look up some details.

Exactly - do not touch them. They have a very fine coating over the electrodes. If you've already measured the gap, you've ruined the coating already.

Using stock versus getting new springs depends on how much you weigh. The standard springs are good for someone up to about (err.....converting to pounds from metric....) 160lb. You could probably use spacers to get them to work for someone up to 170. If you're over that, then looking at new, heavier springs is something that you should definitely do. For example, I come in at about 190lb so I'll be looking to get heavier springs at approx 1.0kg/mm rate. I probably only need 0.95s but I'm going slightly heavier because I have bags and pillion a lot of the time so I'm setting up for that. AFAIK, the heaviest spring you can get from Eibach is 1.04kg/mm. Take a look at the RT site, they have a pretty good calculator there, and others here should be able to help, based on their past experience. The best way to tell if you need springs is to measure the static sag on the bike. To do this you need 2 people. Put the bike on the centerstand and take all the weight off the front wheel. Measure the distance between the bottom triple clamp and the top of the lower fork. Drop the bike off the stand and sit on it, and taking as much weight on the bike as possible - try to avoid having your feet on the ground. Measure again. Work out the difference between the two measurements. If the ideal value is 33-38mm. If you're over about 45mm you won't be able to just use spacers on the springs to bring it up to the right measurements, so you'll need different springs. You can do the same for the rear of the bike too, and the ideal values you're looking for there are 25-30mm. PS: Just got an email from Nick @ Teknik. Says his email problems are fixed. Replied, no bounces yet, which is good.

Ah! I thought you already had those. I can get springs cheap too. Eibach springs (which are the same as what racetech sell). I've got a set coming for my bike so I can always get another set sent along. I believe Racetech are selling them through their site for about $110. IIRC, I'm paying AUD$130 for the springs coming from Oz, which translates to about US$80. Don't quote me on that yet, I'll need to check first and I can't do that until later in the day when the aussies wake up and get to work.

No idea, as from what I can tell there is one guy that is importing this brand to the US, and he's in NY state somewhere, while I'm in Seattle. For comparison pricing, look at RaceTech because they are, for all intents and purposes, selling the same thing. In return I ask: why should it matter to you? Say I was doing this professionally, shouldn't I also cover my costs (international phone calls, postage from Oz to Aus etc)? I'm not, but I've still got most of the same expenses. And, since I'm acting as a middle man, why should I not be expected to add a percentage to the cost? Would you walk into a suspension shop like Traxxion and demand to see his invoices for the parts that he put into your bike and then refuse to pay anything over his invoiced, dealer costs? I'd love to be able to buy these parts at dealer rates, but that's not happening right now, I'm paying full retail for them and they're still far cheaper than comparative products. If you want I'll scan my credit card bill statement in for you and send it to you, but all it's going to have on it is a single line of X total dollars. Maybe there'll be an invoice in the box, don't know. If you're that distrusting of other people, thanks, but no thanks.

Follow on: Just spoke with Nick (BTW, their mail server setup is completely screwed so you'll probably get email bounces!) I've got 4 sets of valves on order (including mine). He's got two sets in stock and has another order that are already on their way from NZ but not in his shop right now (he said they were posted from NZ last Friday). With the turn around time, I suspect it will take about a week before they get sent here, and it's coming by international air mail (insured), meaning probably another week to turn up. Cost for the valve sets is AUD$324 and some pocket change. Once I get the number on my credit card statement, I'll let everyone know what that translates to in USD. He won't charge the cc until he's got all the sets and posts them off, which means by the time it turns up on my account bill, will probably be a couple of weeks from now.

G2 - Cheque is OK with me. XXXXXXXx- yes, it's the whole kit - valves, shims and some setup instructions. It's not the RaceTech setup with an hour long video, but it's good enough. For the bits that the instructions don't help you with, I'm hoping my illustrated tutorial will fill in any missing bits. Anything more than that, and I'll hand out my phone number too.

PGA - so it has a detinite metallic sound to it and not something that sounds like a bicycle pump pumping up tyres.?

Just popping this up to its own thread since I've been getting a collection of PMs about it. Retail price for both compression and rebound valves is AUD$360. In that cost is 10% GST, which can get removed for overseas sales. Given the current exchange rate of about 58c US to one aussie dollar, that would put the cost at about US$185 or so. If I get him to send a couple of sets over in the one mailing then postage will be much cheaper too. Considering that RaceTech sell only compression valves for US$160 or thereabouts, it seems a good deal to me. Since I have my order in with him now and it will ship within a day or two, please let me know ASAP if you're interested. I'm happy to pay for them up front and have people paypal me the amount when I know the real USD value (courtesy of credit card transaction).

The SuspensionTech kits I've got coming are: BP Road Compression Kit: BP Rebound compression kit. In addition to the 1.0kg/mm springs. Right now, because of the availabilty issues direct from the manufacturer, I've got my gear from one of the aussie suppliers. If you would like to contact him directly, send an email to nick@teknikmotorsport.com and tell him I sent you (Justin Couch). All the parts hopefully will be in the mail this week, so if you're interested, you may be able to get the purchased and put into the same bundle as mine. Then, when they get here, I'll divvy the bits up and send them on to people. Means you'll end up paying a bit more for them though, but at least you'll get a full kit for less price than the same from RaceTech (aussie dollar conversion helps greatly too!) The only "special" tool that you'll need for these valves is a 1.0mm drill bit (ie metric, not SAE). In the racetech valves you drill the compression pistons out to make them bigger, whereas with the ST valves, you work on the rebound side, hence the much smaller drillbit needed. If you've never done valves before but reasonably confident weilding a set of spanners, set aside probably a half a day. He'll send valves over with the shimstacks already set up for you. Personally, I'm going to be playing with them quite a bit so it will take me much longer to find something that I'm really happy with. Also, since I'm doing the F3 conversion, it will be marginally simpler for me than you because I just drop out a couple of bolts and the whole fork internals just slide out and drop in new ones. And yes, as stated before, this is going to be very well documented. Doing RaceTech valves is pretty much the same, but minor differences, such as where you drill out holes etc. In all honesty, I don't think it really matter which kit you go with for road riding - ST or RT. They're both orders of magnitude better than the stock valving. The rest comes down to little details like the construction materials. Oh, and the other thing - if you got the ST race valves, they are a direct knockoff of the Ohlins valves pictured above, but just using different materials.

That's definitely one thing on my mind - may have gone too heavy on the fork oil and the squealing is from the fluid attempting to force it's way through the valves, but I wanted to get more info from him first without offering a possible cause (trying to lead him to a conclusion about the source).