testrider Posted March 26, 2006 Share Posted March 26, 2006 HI all, I just checked my front brake (97 XX with 26k miles). The front brake pads were original since it was new. I found the left front side brake pads were worn almost to the wear mark so I replaced them with a set of EBC HH pads. The right side pads were still good so I didn't replace the right side. - I'm pretty sure sure it's perfectly ok to replace just one side, even though now I"m sure that the left side EBC HH bites more than the right side stock pads? - Is it your experience that the left front side pads are usually worn more than the right side (due to our LBS or whatever)? Thank you very much for any comments. -Mike- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman_40 Posted March 26, 2006 Share Posted March 26, 2006 - I'm pretty sure sure it's perfectly ok to replace just one side, even though now I"m sure that the left side EBC HH bites more than the right side stock pads? - Is it your experience that the left front side pads are usually worn more than the right side (due to our LBS or whatever)? Thank you very much for any comments. -Mike- Yes the pads don't wear evenly. And I don't think it's a good idea not to change the pads in sets. I would never use two totally different pads on each rotor. I would make sure my front 4 pads were the same but that's just me I may be worng. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete in PA Posted March 26, 2006 Share Posted March 26, 2006 Change all the pads on the front at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rockmeupto125 Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 As has been stated--------- Every pad on one wheel should be the same brand and type of pad. Its okay to replace one pad if they're all the same material. Do NOT mix and match. The left side normally wears faster than the right, and at an angle. A cursory examination of your caliper may not show the wear...remove and inspect before you toast a rotor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonox Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 just for the dummy in me, why is that joe? pads grip a rotor - the floating nature of these 3pot calipers means you get an even pressure on each pad of the pair. If you replace each caliper as a set, it shouldn't matter what the other caliper is running - front wheel has two rotors; if one set of pads has less friction coeff., then you are just running most braking on one rotor with the rest being taken up by the other rotor - all torque reactions can be taken by each respective carrier and there are plenty of bikes around with a single front rotor, and all rears have one only anyway - what's the problem with having independant sets in each front caliper? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rockmeupto125 Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 Well, the first reason is uneven, and therefore unpredictable wear...perhaps sooner than you might think possible, and suddenly your last-ditch attempt at a stoppie brings nothing but a grinding of metal. Second is that if you're like me, and prone to finding yourself 1000+ miles from home when you're bored, you can switch pads around if one is wearing out, and still maintain the basic functiona and feel because you're using the same material. And third, your argument is technically correct...especially in consideration that there are lots and lots of single caliper bikes out there. Changing the character of the friction material will alter the LBS actuation, but that's true any time you change pads. But then again, technically, the left pads shouldn't wear faster than the rights, and not at an angle. But they do. And that's why I think minimizing differences between the left and right calipers is better, and will help in trouble-shooting as well. And fouth...I think its a stupid idea. Put on shoes from two completely different pair, and go to work. See what you think about it after a shift. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVLXX Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 pads grip a rotor - the floating nature of these 3pot calipers means you get an even pressure on each pad of the pair. If you replace each caliper as a set, it shouldn't matter what the other caliper is running - front wheel has two rotors; if one set of pads has less friction coeff., then you are just running most braking on one rotor with the rest being taken up by the other rotor - all torque reactions can be taken by each respective carrier and there are plenty of bikes around with a single front rotor, and all rears have one only anyway - what's the problem with having independant sets in each front caliper? You said it.... You are going to increase or decrease the Heat generated buy one or the other... because one set is going to grab better than the other, therfore it could and will geterate more heat than the rotor was designed to handle, and therfore you run a higher risk of Warping that rotor. Besides what are you really saving.... the cost of half of a set of brake pads... at the risk of warping a rotor????? Just change both sets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shovelstrokeed Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 To add another reason why not, especially if the odd set has a different coeeficient of friction, you will twist your forks each time you brake. The caliper is mounted to the fork leg. All the braking forces are transmitted through that mount to the fork and they are considerable. The axle clamp and lower triple are not designed to take asymetric forces. It will certianly impact handling during hard braking. Not a good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testrider Posted March 27, 2006 Author Share Posted March 27, 2006 THank you all for the advises and comments, I appreciate them. I'm going to replace the other side then as I already bought the pads. On a side note, I noticed that the OEM pads looks exactly like my new EBC HH pads, did the XX came from the factory with EBC pads on them? Thanks again. Your comments are valuable. -mike- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rockmeupto125 Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 No, it did not. But there's only so many ways a brake pad can look, eh? Shovel........not to argue the point......I agree there is some fork twist. But I don't agree there is a dangerous amount. In light of your post, how do you explain the four Hondas in my garage with single sided front disk brakes? We used to buy crashed forks for our CB750's so that we could pirate the caliper and corresponding fork leg and install dual disks. Better braking, but I don't recall that it changed the braking characteristics when braking forces were shared between two rotors rather than one. ???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonox Posted March 27, 2006 Share Posted March 27, 2006 i agree on the being caught out with no material left on one caliper, but you could quite happily run a new set of greens in one side and a set of sintered metal in the other side and still have a perfectly functional set of front brakes. The wearing two different shoes is not a good analogy because i'd need four feet, and if each shoe is comfortable, there is no difference between sides. Bikes are massively overbraked anyway, which is why you can pull up a 500 pound missile at 180mph using two fingers of one hand or put them on a track with no changes at all. (unlike practically every car out there). For street use, you'll never get a high enough heat load into them to warp a disc unless you are abusing them all the way down a huge hill in neutral! The pressure supplying the rear caliper is generated from the braking effort applied to the front, and if getting less action on the rear is desired, you could easily do it by putting a set of lower coeff. pads in the left caliper. (or more coeff. if you wanted more rear bias). Greater emphasis could be had by putting lower coeff. pads in the rear as well, which would get you a little LBS, but better than none at all and much cheaper than a delink kit. (at the cost of accelerated wear of the right rotor compared to the left - but you could swap these periodically) The master cylinder does not lie directly in line with the caliper line of action, so you would expect it to wear slightly off axis, especially if the bushes start to wear. My point is that there is no technical or operational reason that dictates identical pad materials in left and right front calipers, particularly if you replace the whole front set at a time, and you can use knowledge of their behaviour to tune the linked brakes if you wish. I agree that keeping a worn out set with a 'little to go' is false economy though. shovel, it is not a twisting force about the steering axis - it is a bending load in the fork, and if the fork couldn't handle the load, you would have them bending under the load required to pull the bike up, whether or not you had two calipers or one, or even no brakes at all and just a drag bar pushing on the axle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testrider Posted March 28, 2006 Author Share Posted March 28, 2006 Thank you all! I am going to replace the right side, then put the right front pads to the rear as they still have plenty of material. For some reasons, I had to replace my rear pads at around 13k miles while I still have my original stock front pads at 26k miles and the rear pads are wearing thin again now at 26k miles. Thanks again! -mike- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rockmeupto125 Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 Bonox...I believe you're technically correct in all counts. Congratulations. I'll stand by my advice to testrider, however. If you're really savvy enough to be tuning your brakes in the described fashion, you're not asking questions about it. Testrider........if your brakes are OEM, the fronts won't fit the rear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shovelstrokeed Posted March 28, 2006 Share Posted March 28, 2006 No, it did not. But there's only so many ways a brake pad can look, eh? Shovel........not to argue the point......I agree there is some fork twist. But I don't agree there is a dangerous amount. In light of your post, how do you explain the four Hondas in my garage with single sided front disk brakes? We used to buy crashed forks for our CB750's so that we could pirate the caliper and corresponding fork leg and install dual disks. Better braking, but I don't recall that it changed the braking characteristics when braking forces were shared between two rotors rather than one. ???? I did the same thing on my old CB750's, I had a 69, a 70 and a 71. To me, it was easy to notice the difference. It really wan't dramatic except on the inital application of the brake. With the single disk you could actually feel the bars wanting to turn a bit. The duals took that away but man those old disks were heavy. Of course with those skinny 32mm fork legs and 17mm front axle, with, as I recall, single pinch bolts, it didn't take much force to twist things. Today's stuff is just so much stiffer I'm probably just being an ol' fogey. The principle will still apply but, in practice, it problable don't matter worth a damn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testrider Posted March 28, 2006 Author Share Posted March 28, 2006 Bonox...I believe you're technically correct in all counts. Congratulations. I'll stand by my advice to testrider, however. If you're really savvy enough to be tuning your brakes in the described fashion, you're not asking questions about it. Testrider........if your brakes are OEM, the fronts won't fit the rear. Thanks again. The EBC HH pads I bought for the front and rear have the same part number and they all don't have the notch as I saw a pic here posted in another thread and they all fit just fine. I haven't tried to put the OEM front to the rear yet... Mine is a 97. -mike- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testrider Posted March 29, 2006 Author Share Posted March 29, 2006 Hi all, How do I reduce the brake pad drag on the rotor? I put my XX on the centerstand and both rear and front wheels have some drags after the brakes are released. I already lubricated the brake pad pins. Is there anything else I can do to make the pad dragging completely go away? Thanks again. -mike- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porterb123 Posted March 29, 2006 Share Posted March 29, 2006 Hi all, How do I reduce the brake pad drag on the rotor? I put my XX on the centerstand and both rear and front wheels have some drags after the brakes are released. I already lubricated the brake pad pins. Is there anything else I can do to make the pad dragging completely go away? Thanks again. -mike- Not much to make it completely go away, but did you clean off the pistons real well. The grung ring build up on the piston will drag on the seal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
testrider Posted March 29, 2006 Author Share Posted March 29, 2006 Hi all, How do I reduce the brake pad drag on the rotor? I put my XX on the centerstand and both rear and front wheels have some drags after the brakes are released. I already lubricated the brake pad pins. Is there anything else I can do to make the pad dragging completely go away? Thanks again. -mike- Not much to make it completely go away, but did you clean off the pistons real well. The grung ring build up on the piston will drag on the seal Thanks! I didn't clean the pistion at all as I didn't remove the caliper when replacing the pads. I'm going to remove the calibers and clean them out to see if it will improve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02BIRD Posted March 30, 2006 Share Posted March 30, 2006 won't it pull to one side it will also cup your tires Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Para045 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 HI all, I just checked my front brake (97 XX with 26k miles). The front brake pads were original since it was new. I found the left front side brake pads were worn almost to the wear mark so I replaced them with a set of EBC HH pads. The right side pads were still good so I didn't replace the right side. -Mike- Just found something on http://www.superblackbird.com/lbs.cfm that I thought was interesting - it was stated that on the linked brake system there is something called a delay valve in the rear braking system that supposedly when you apply the foot brake, gently applies pressure to the left front caliper first and then as pedal pressure increases it then starts to apply pressure to the right front caliper. Maybe this is why the left pads wear quicker than the right?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLY DVL Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 My understanding of the link system was - when braking with the rear only all pistons on the rear caliper are applied but only 1 on the l/f caliper causing one pad to wear at an angle. K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
01xxallen Posted January 14, 2007 Share Posted January 14, 2007 I had to get the book out. When you squeeze the front brake it applies pressure to the outer pistons of both front calipers. The left caliper moves up causing pressure to flow to the outer pistons of the rear caliper. This goes through a proportional control valve which prevents the rear wheel from locking up during extreme braking. When you step on the rear brake pedal, pressure is applied to the center piston of the rear caliper, as well as the center piston of each front piston. The front left caliper moves up again applying pressure to the outer pistons of the rear. A delay valve is used in the front so that pressure is applied only to the front left caliper until pressure rises to a preset level and then the valve opens allowing pressure to go to the right front caliper. That's to prevent nose dive during braking. Okay, that explains why the left front pads wear faster than the right front. But not why they would wear unevenly. (angle). In theory pressure is never applied to the top piston but not the bottom in any condition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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